Fox News falsely claims Dems voted to "protect," "defend" pedophiles
SUMMARY: Sean Hannity, Bill Hemmer, and The Fox Nation advanced the false claim that House Democrats voted to "protect" or "defend" pedophiles by voting against an amendment to the Local Law Enforcement Hate Crimes Prevention Act.
Discussing the Local Law Enforcement Hate Crimes Prevention Act, which defines as a federal crime certain acts of violence or attempted violence "because of the actual or perceived religion, national origin, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, or disability of any person," Fox News hosts Sean Hannity and Bill Hemmer, and The Fox Nation, have all recently advanced the false claim that House Democrats voted to "protect" or "defend" pedophiles by voting against an amendment to the bill by Rep. Steve King (R-IA) stating that "the term 'sexual orientation' shall not include pedophilia."* In fact, as Rep. Tammy Baldwin (D-WI) noted during an April 23 House Judiciary Committee hearing, the term "sexual orientation" is already defined by federal statute as applying only to "consensual homosexuality or heterosexuality," thereby excluding pedophiles, who engage in nonconsensual sexual relationships with children. In providing her reasons for opposing King's amendment, Baldwin said that it "is unnecessary and, I would add, inflammatory in terms of insinuations."
During the May 5 edition of his Fox News program, Hannity teased a segment by claiming that "Democrats just voted to extend special legal protections to pedophiles" and later claimed that Democrats had included a "special category for pedophiles" in the hate crimes bill. Additionally, while interviewing King, Hannity asserted: "I want to be perfectly clear. So hate -- we have a hate crimes bill, and you're saying, all right, we should exempt pedophiles. Every Democrat says no." King replied that Hannity had it "absolutely right," and that "on the top of that, the amendment that I offered to exempt pedophiles from a special protected status was after Tammy Baldwin, one of the lead sponsors on the bill, had argued that the sexual orientation, special protective status in the bill, only covered heterosexuals and homosexuals, so that doesn't include a pedophile. But she opposed the amendment anyway, as did all the Democrats, as you just showed tonight." Later, when Hannity asked King, "Is it safe to say that Democrats were willing to protect pedophiles?" King replied: "Sean, it is a matter of congressional record. Absolutely true -- beyond any doubt whatsoever."
Similarly, during the May 6 edition of Fox News's America's Newsroom, Fox News ran on-screen text that read, "House Dems vote to protect pedophiles, but not veterans":

Hemmer teased the segment by saying Democrats had reportedly "voted to give special protection to pedophiles." Also, a May 6 headline on The Fox Nation -- Fox News' purportedly bias-free website -- read: "House Democrats Defend Pedophiles Over Veterans."
In her statement opposing King's amendment, Baldwin noted that given the definition of "sexual orientation" under federal law "it is absolutely clear that that could not include pedophilia":
BALDWIN: I move to strike the last word in opposition to this amendment, that, well -- the gentleman claims that we have not pinned down the definition for sexual orientation. And, indeed, in our earlier session, yet today, I drew his attention to the fact that there is a definition with regard to the Hate Crimes Statistics Act. During the break, I searched to just confirm that what I had articulated earlier today was indeed the definition and it is: "Sexual orientation is means consensual homosexuality or heterosexuality." That is the definition.
Now, as you've noted earlier, there's only one term defined in this legislation, and that's gender identity on page 14. And the reason for that is that that definition exists nowhere else in federal law. This is the first time it's occurring in federal law. But in every other case, gender disability, sexual orientation, race, national origin, color, and -- I'm missing one. The architecture of the hate crime statutes in the United States is those definitions do not lay within that architecture. They exist elsewhere in federal law, and we rely on them. So there is a clear, concise definition of sexual orientation.
Your amendment is unnecessary and, I would add, inflammatory in terms of insinuations, I would say. But given the definition of sexual orientation meaning "consensual homosexuality or heterosexuality," it is absolutely clear that that could not include pedophilia.
Indeed, as Baldwin noted, the 2005 Hate Crimes Statistics Act states:
Nothing in this section creates a cause of action or a right to bring an action, including an action based on discrimination due to sexual orientation. As used in this section, the term 'sexual orientation' means consensual homosexuality or heterosexuality. This subsection does not limit any existing cause of action or right to bring an action, including any action under the administrative Procedure Act or the All Writs Act.
From the May 6 edition of Fox News' Hannity:
HANNITY: Democrats vote to protect pedophiles but not veterans in the hate crimes bill?
[...]
HANNITY: And coming up: We told you last week how Democrats oppose protecting veterans under the new hate crimes act. Well, guess what? They did decide to offer protection to pedophiles. The unbelievable details are straight ahead, and much more.
[...]
HANNITY: Democrats just voted to extend special legal protections to pedophiles but refuse to give combat veterans those same protections. Now, do you think that party needs to think long and hard about their priorities?
[...]
HANNITY: Now, during last week's debate on the hate crimes bill, Republicans proposed an amendment that would exempt pedophiles from receiving the protections of that bill that offers victims of hate crimes.
Now, the Democrats voted unanimously against the amendment. Here's what they said.
CLERK OF THE HOUSE: Mr. Scott votes no [...] Ms. Lofgren votes no [...] Mr. Cohen votes no [...] Mr. Johnson votes no [...] Mr. Pierluisi votes no [...] Mr. Gutierrez votes no [...] Mr. Sherman votes no [...] Ms. Baldwin votes no [...] Mr. Weiner votes no [...] Mr. Maffei votes no [...] Mr. Wexler votes no [...] Ms. Waters --
HANNITY: Now, meanwhile, as we first reported on this program last week, one Democratic congresswoman denounced an idea that veterans should receive any sort of protections at all.
And joining me now to discuss what exactly unfolded is Congressman Steve King. He sponsored the amendment that would have excluded pedophiles from this legislation. Congressman, good to see you.
KING: Thanks, Sean. It's good to be with you tonight.
HANNITY: I want to be perfectly clear. So hate -- we have a hate crimes bill, and you're saying, all right, we should exempt pedophiles. Every Democrat says no. But when there is -- the sponsorship of the bill that would also include veterans that are victims of crimes because they're veterans, Democrats -- they wanted them exempt but the pedophiles in. Do I have that right?
KING: You have it right, Sean. They were wrong on both counts, obviously. But you have it absolutely right. And on the top of that, the amendment that I offered to exempt pedophiles from a special protected status was after Tammy Baldwin, one of the lead sponsors on the bill, had argued that the sexual orientation, special protective status in the bill, only covered heterosexuals and homosexuals, so that doesn't include a pedophile. But she opposed the amendment anyway, as did all the Democrats, as you just showed tonight.
HANNITY: All right, Congressman. I got to slow down here, because I don't think I got this right. So the Democrats voted against special protected status to pedophiles in this bill.
KING: Yes.
HANNITY: But when they had a chance to offer special protected status to veterans returning from Iraq, Afghanistan, and other wars, they said no. Tell me that I -- tell me that that didn't happen in Washington. Tell me that I'm really -- I got this whole thing messed up and backwards.
[...]
HANNITY: So I'm trying to understand it. Are we trying, through hate crimes legislation, to get into the thought process behind the crime instead of just punishing the actual crime and the actual act?
KING: Well, Sean, it is a thought. It is the thought crime. And I tried to bring this out in the mark-up before the Judiciary Committee. And I asked the specific question of the sponsors: Is it the perception of the perpetrator, or the perception of the victim?
And I got different answers. But, truthfully, it's both. Now we're trying to, by law, divine what was in head -- in the head of the victimizer, and what's in the head of the victim, who is self-alleged with their particular proclivity and would be protected by law given the circumstances of the legislation that passed off the floor of the House of Representatives.
So I think this is an area of law that we should stay completely away from. I think it brings about this special protected status. And I think that when you set up people that are -- that are victims, then you're dividing people. And so this is an agenda --
HANNITY: All right.
KING: -- of the homosexual activists. And they take this all the way through to imposing same-sex marriage on America.
HANNITY: Right.
KING: That's another part of this, and public affirmation is the goal.
HANNITY: We're running out of time. Is it safe to say that Democrats were willing to protect pedophiles but not offer the same protection to servicemen and women? Is that an accurate statement?
KING: Sean, it is a matter of congressional record. Absolutely true -- beyond any doubt whatsoever. The recorded votes are there to prove just what you've said. They -- and on top of that, [Rep.] Alcee Hastings [D] from Florida, that spoke on the rules debate, and he read a list of about 30 different paraphilias -- proclivities, I call them -- including pedophiles, necrophilia, and a number of things that I wouldn't say on this program or any other. And he said I think all philias whatsoever should be protected by this law.
That means every perversion that you can imagine would be special protected status under the Democrats' bill that passed off the -- floor of the House of Representatives.
[...]
HANNITY: All right. Let's ask this question. We had this segment with Congressman King earlier in the program today. And, literally, we showed the tape. Democrats literally -- he put in an amendment that, in the hate crimes legislation, that pedophiles wouldn't be covered.
All right. Now, I'm against hate crimes altogether, because I want to punish people that commit crimes, not trying to understand the thought process.
STEVE MURPHY (Democratic Strategist): So you're for the legislation?
HANNITY: No, no. I'm against it.
PAMELA GELLER (Atlas Shrugs blogger): Me too.
MURPHY: Exactly.
HANNITY: No, I'm against it.
MURPHY: Exactly.
HANNITY: But the Democrats that would not -- that insisted that pedophiles be included, they denied veterans the same protection. You're the Democrat here. Can you explain or justify that?
MURPHY: It's an absolute stunt. There is no protection for pedophiles in this legislation. It's an attempt to hold people accountable who commit crimes against gays --
HANNITY: You're not answering. No --
MURPHY: -- against Jews, against minorities --
HANNITY: Steve, you gotta be --
MURPHY: -- against women --
HANNITY: Steve, wait a minute. Hang on a second.
MURPHY: -- simply because of what they are.
HANNITY: Steve, they gave an amendment, a special amendment that would take out the protection for pedophiles. All the Democrats voted against it. When they voted -- when they had a vote to protect our veterans, they -- in that case, they weren't going to include them.
MURPHY: Because it was an attempt to kill the legislation by requiring thousands of categories to have to be put in there, as these people are exempt.
HANNITY: All right, so Steve --
GELLER: [Inaudible]
MURPHY: Just like they did with civil rights. Just like they did -- they stopped the legislation against lynching.
HANNITY: It was Robert Byrd -- it was Robert Byrd who was out there filibustering the civil rights bill -- and a lot of the former Klansmen, so --.
MURPHY: Exactly.
GELLER: Listen, I think hate crimes is such a dangerous -- such a dangerous line in the sand. It's like hate speech. To me, all crime is hate. Whatever is motivating you --
HANNITY: Great point. Great point.
GELLER: -- whatever it is that you do, it's hate. Why would you want -- this is America. It's based on the Constitution, rugged individualism.
Why would you want special classes? Why would you want a special class? It is absolutely, positively un-American.
MURPHY: It is a special problem. It is a special problem.
GELLER: A special problem? Where? In what -- yeah --
HANNITY: It's a special problems for veterans. Veterans come home, and they get spit at. Veterans come home and they get called names. Even Harry Reid --
MURPHY: It's the Star of Davids that get knocked over in the cemeteries, not the crosses.
HANNITY: No, you know what? It's veterans -- talk to them. Because I do talk to them. And I do a lot of concerts for them every year, and I get to meet them. If we're going to apply that special protection for pedophiles, shouldn't we at least apply it to veterans?
GREG BUTTLE (former NFL linebacker): Well, a hundred percent. I don't think anyone should ever not even think about that. As a matter of fact, I think they should take veterans, and if you ever served in real combat, don't pay federal taxes anymore.
HANNITY: I agree.
GELLER: Hear, hear.
BUTTLE: I mean, come on.
MURPHY: What happens if you're a veteran pedophile? What are you going to do about that?
GELLER: It's double -- double jeopardy.
HANNITY: Well, you're protected under the pedophile part, but not the veteran part. That's your answer.
GELLER: Yeah, from the waist up, you're covered.
HANNITY: Because the Democrats -- the Democrats protected the --
MURPHY: It's silly. It's a silly argument.
GELLER: It's not.
MURPHY: It's a phony, silly argument.
GELLER: It's a phony, silly law.
HANNITY: -- protected the special category for pedophiles, but they didn't protect it for veterans, and they had both votes. They put their vote on record. It's amazing to me.
From the May 5 edition of Fox News's America's Newsroom:
HEMMER: The conservative blogs are all over this story this morning. -- a report that House Democrats voted to give special protection to pedophiles.
From the April 23 House Judiciary Committee hearing:
KING: This amendment goes to the end of the bill, and it simply says, since we have apparently waived the reading of it, which I do -- it's very short -- it says, "The term sexual orientation as used in this act or any amendments to this act does not include pedophilia." And we've gone through in this debate significant discussion about what sexual orientation means and does not mean. And yet I have not heard from the proponents of this bill into the record a definition of sexual orientation.
I would like to have defined sexual orientation precisely. I recognize, Mr. Chairman, it's unlikely that we will get that done in this committee given the reticence on the part of the majority party to consider any of the changes that we've offered here -- I think in a fashion that is determined to bring this bill out of this committee. And I'm frustrated that we're not able to add better definitions to the ambiguous terms to lock people up in penitentiaries if this bill becomes law.
And, so, this amendment that I have addresses the issue of pedophiles. And under the term "sexual orientation," if it includes those types of proclivities, particularly the one that is most egregious of all -- and that is victimizing children for the sake of sexual activity with them -- the pedophiles should not be protected under this legislation if we're able to adopt this language that's in my amendment. So, my amendment does not specifically define sexual orientation, although I've tried to do that.
But what it does do is say it doesn't include pedophiles, because I think the intent of this committee is clearly that we don't want to provide a, let's just say, special-protected status, for pedophiles. There are others that I would put in that list as well, but this is the one that stands out to me. It should be beyond question that this committee should be able to take a look at this amendment and conclude that whatever we might think about proclivities, pedophiles is not one that should be included. And, so, that's what my -- I'd yield.
REP. JOHN CONYERS (D-MI): The gentleman yields. I want to compliment him on the tenacity with which he has pursued specificity and the seeking of the definitions of many of these terms that are generally, frequently taken for granted, or thought to be somewhere in the law already existing.
KING: Reclaiming -- I thank the gentleman chairman for recognizing that. And I'd point out again that I do have some history with these terms, and having been involved in litigation of these terms, I understand, I think, from that experience the implications that might come forward with this kind of language that seemed to be accepted by a lot of members of this panel.
And so I would urge adoption of my amendment that defines clearly that whatever sexual orientation is, it is not, and does not include pedophiles. And with that, Mr. Chairman, I'd urge adoption of my amendment, and I would yield back the balance of my time.
BALDWIN: Thank you Mr. Chairman. I move to strike the last word in opposition to this amendment, that, well -- the gentleman claims that we have not pinned down the definition for sexual orientation. And, indeed, in our earlier session, yet today, I drew his attention to the fact that there is a definition with regard to the Hate Crimes Statistics Act. During the break, I searched to just confirm that what I had articulated earlier today was indeed the definition and it is: "Sexual orientation is means consensual homosexuality or heterosexuality." That is the definition.
Now, as you've noted earlier, there's only one term defined in this legislation, and that's gender identity on page 14. And the reason for that is that that definition exists nowhere else in federal law. This is the first time it's occurring in federal law. But in every other case, gender disability, sexual orientation, race, national origin, color, and -- I'm missing one. The architecture of the hate crime statutes in the United States is those definitions do not lay within that architecture. They exist elsewhere in federal law, and we rely on them. So there is a clear, concise definition of sexual orientation.
Your amendment is unnecessary and, I would add, inflammatory in terms of insinuations, I would say. But given the definition of sexual orientation meaning "consensual homosexuality or heterosexuality," it is absolutely clear that that could not include pedophilia.















What they're doing, therefore, is trying to smear the existing bill, and the Democrat sponsors of that bill, by lying about what is in that bill.
And when I think of a party protecting pedophiles I think of liberal judges who give them light sentences with sometimes no jail time at all. Compassionate liberalism, for the criminal not the victims.
As for the Pedophile clause...? If the word "pedophile" is not IN the bill in the first place, calling for their protection as a group, then WHY do they need to be excepted? They don't. The bill gives them nothing from the start. Again a pointless, shameless exercise in padering, this time to the religious nut-bags who still think homosexual somehow means pedophiles. Saying we need to except pedophiles is like saying we need to except martians - or any OTHER group that never got special protection by this bill anyway!!!
The 'pub's are just wasting everybodies time with this, and trying to make the dem's look bad with this shameless, pointless and sensless pandering. They add meaningless amendments just so the adults in the room vote them down, all in order to give Fox something to babble about. If you can't see that, you're an idiot.
I am no cheerleader for hate crime legislation, but I certainly do not think our veterans are a class of people that needs special protection. I think more of our veterans than that - they can take care of themselves. Too bad the Republicans and "fair" liberal think so little of them.
And who throws spit?
Actually Ted Kennedy or Barney Frank were not charged or convicted of any crime, you inbred hick. But if you want to speak of criminal behavior by politicians:
REP. JOHN YOUNG (D-Tex.):
On June 11, 1976, Colleen Gardner, a former staff secretary to Young, told the New York Times that Young increased her salary after she gave in to his sexual advances. In November, Young, who had run unopposed in the safe Democratic district five consecutive times, w More..as reelected with just 61 percent of the vote. The scandal wouldn't go away, and in 1978 Young was defeated in a Democratic primary runoff.
REP. ALLAN HOWE (D-Utah):
On June 13, 1976, Howe was arrested in Salt Lake City on charges of soliciting two policewomen posing as prostitutes. Howe insisted he was set up and refused to resign. But the Democratic Party distanced itself from his candidacy and he was trounced by his Republican opponent in the November election.
REP. FRED RICHMOND (D-N.Y.):
In April 1978, Richmond was arrested in Washington for soliciting sex from a 16-year-old boy. Richmond apologized for his actions, conceding he "made bad judgments involving my private life." In spite of a Democratic primary opponent's attempts to cash in on the headlines, Richmond easily won renomination and reelection. But his career came to an end four years later when, after pleading guilty to possession of marijuana and tax evasion - and amid allegations that he had his staff procure cocaine for him -- he resigned his seat.
REP. JOHN HINSON (D-Miss.):
On Aug. 8, 1980, during his first reelection bid, Hinson stunned everyone by announcing that in 1976 he had been accused of committing an obscene act at a gay haunt in Virginia. Hinson, married and a strong conservative, added that in 1977 he had survived a fire in a gay D.C. movie theater. He was making the disclosure, he said, because he needed to clear his conscience. But he denied he was a homosexual and refused GOP demands that he resign. Hinson won reelection in a three-way race, with 39 percent of the vote. But three months later, he was arrested on charges of attempted oral sodomy in the restroom of a House office building. He resigned his seat on April 13, 1981.
REP. ROBERT BAUMAN (D-Md.):
On Oct. 3, 1980, Bauman, a leading "pro-family" conservative, pleaded innocent to a charge that he committed oral sodomy on a teenage boy in Washington. Married and the father of four, Bauman conceded that he had been an alcoholic but had been seeking treatment. The news came as a shock to voters of the rural, conservative district, and he lost to a Democrat in November.
REP. DAN CRANE (R-Ill.) and REP. GERRY STUDDS (D-Mass.):
The House ethics committee on July 14, 1983, announced that Crane and Studds had sexual relationships with teenage congressional pages -- Crane with a 17-year-old female in 1980, Studds with a 17-year-old male in 1973. Both admitted the charges that same day, and Studds acknowledged he was gay. The committee voted to reprimand the two, but a back-bench Georgia Republican named Newt Gingrich argued that they should be expelled. The full House voted on July 20 instead to censure the two, the first time that ever happened for sexual misconduct. Crane, married and the father of six, was tearful in his apology to the House, while Studds refused to apologize. Crane's conservative district voted him out in 1984, while the voters in Studds's more liberal district were more forgiving. Studds won reelection in 1984 with 56 percent of the vote, and continued to win until he retired in 1996.
REP. ERNIE KONNYU (D-Calif.):
In August 1987, two former Konnyu aides complained to the San Jose Mercury News that the freshman Republican had sexually harassed them. GOP leaders were unhappy with Konnyu's temperament to begin with, so it took little effort to find candidates who would take him on in the primary. Stanford professor Tom Campbell ousted Konnyu the following June.
SEN. BROCK ADAMS (D-Wash.):
On Sept. 27, 1988, Seattle newspapers reported that Kari Tupper, the daughter of Adams's longtime friends, filed a complaint against the Washington Democrat in July of 1987, charging sexual assault. She claimed she went to Adams's house in March 1987 to get him to end a pattern of harassment, but that he drugged her and assaulted her. Adams denied any sexual assault, saying they only talked about her employment opportunities. Adams continued raising campaign funds and declared for a second term in February of 1992. But two weeks later the Seattle Times reported that eight other women were accusing Adams of sexual molestation over the past 20 years, describing a history of drugging and subsequent rape. Later that day, while still proclaiming his innocence, Adams ended his campaign.
REP. JIM BATES (D-Calif.):
Roll Call quoted former Bates aides in October 1988 saying that the San Diego Democrat made sexual advances toward female staffers. Bates called it a GOP-inspired smear campaign, but also apologized for anything he did that might have seemed inappropriate. The story came too close to Election Day to damage Bates, who won easily. However, the following October the ethics committee sent Bates a "letter of reproval" directing him to make a formal apology to the women who filed the complaint. Although the district was not thought to be hospitable to the GOP, Randy "Duke" Cunningham, a former Navy pilot who was once shot down over North Vietnam, ousted Bates in 1990 by fewer than 2,000 votes.
REP. GUS SAVAGE (D-Ill.):
The Washington Post reported on July 19, 1989, that Savage had fondled a Peace Corps volunteer while on an official visit to Zaire. Savage called the story a lie and blamed it on his political enemies and a racist media. (Savage is black.) In January 1990, the House ethics committee decided that the events did occur, but decided against any disciplinary action because Savage wrote a letter to the woman saying he "never intended to offend" her. Savage was reelected in 1990, but finally ousted in the 1992 primary by Mel Reynolds.
REP. BARNEY FRANK (D-Mass.):
In response to a story in the Aug. 25, 1989, Washington Times, Frank confirmed that he hired Steve Gobie, a male prostitute, in 1985 to live with and work for him in his D.C. apartment. But Frank, who is gay, said he fired Gobie in 1987 when he learned he was using the apartment to run a prostitution service. The Boston Globe, among others, called on Frank to resign, but he refused. On July 19, 1990, the ethics committee recommended Frank be reprimanded because he "reflected discredit upon the House" by using his congressional office to fix 33 of Gobie's parking tickets. Attempts to expel or censure Frank failed; instead the House voted 408-18 to reprimand him. The fury in Washington was not shared in Frank's district, where he won reelection in 1990 with 66 percent of the vote, and has won by larger margins ever since.
SEN. DANIEL INOUYE (D-Hawaii):
In October 1992, Republican Senate nominee Rick Reed began running a campaign commercial that included a surreptitiously taped interview with Lenore Kwock, Inouye's hairdresser. Kwock said Inouye had sexually forced himself on her in 1975 and continued a pattern of sexual harassment, even as Kwock continued to cut his hair over the years. Inouye, seeking a sixth term, denied the charges. And Kwock said that by running the commercial, Reed had caused her more pain than Inouye had. Reed was forced to pull the ad, and while many voters took out their anger on the Republican, Inouye was held to 57 percent of the vote - the lowest total of his career. A week later, a female Democratic state legislator announced that she had heard from nine other women who claimed Inouye had sexually harassed them over the past decade. But the women didn't go public with their claims, the local press didn't pursue the story, and the Senate Ethics Committee decided to drop the investigation because the accusers wouldn't participate in an inquiry.
REP MEL REYNOLDS (D-Ill.):
Freshman Reynolds was indicted on Aug. 19, 1994, on charges of having sex with a 16-year-old campaign worker and then pressuring her to lie about it. Reynolds, who is black, denied the charges and said the investigation was racially motivated. The GOP belatedly put up a write-in candidate for November, but Reynolds dispatched him in the overwhelmingly Democratic district with little effort. Reynolds was convicted on Aug. 22, 1995 of 12 counts of sexual assault, obstruction of justice and solicitation of child pornography, was sentenced to five years in prison, and resigned his seat on October 1. Less..
" Dems voted to "protect," "defend" pedophiles"
what is your fair opinion, (as Hannity would ask) yes or no?
Now how about a nice hot cup of STFU?
Count only the number of "plead guilty to's" and "covicted of's" on that site - it's over 50, and that ignores the "arrested for's" and "accused of's" - and I think you see that there's no only some hypocrasy going on, but rather a bit of projection and "drity-laundry-hiding" by way of distraction.
The fact remains that Democratic men who do cheat on their wives (as reprehensiable behavior as that is) do so with grown women, as opposed conservatives who seem to often do so with underaged boys.
Fox are so stupid that they don't know that a Hate Crime is defined by the victim,not the offender....this amendment is actually a vote AGAINST protecting paedophiles.
I'd be interested to see who voted in favor! Why do I have the feeling that this one will quickly disappear....
While I disagree with you that the amendment is a vote against protecting pedophiles, you do make a good point about the crime being defined by the victim as to the perpetrator's intent.
That is simply ridiculous and shows how far the legal system has strayed from clear thinking. Can anyone name any "hate" crime that is not already covered by existing legislation? The crime should not be dependent on the victim's definition, but by the commission of the act.
The whole bill is as Baldwin said, "...unnecessary and, I would add, inflammatory in terms of insinuations."
That's why the entire bill is necessary. The reason the proposed amendment is not necessary is that sexual orientation already does not include pedophilia. By the way, that's also the reason it's false that anyone protected pedophiles. The reason the amendment was inflammatory is that it suggested an equivalence between homosexuality and pedophilia. Steve King, Republican of Iowa, knew this. It was a not-very-clever trap: either vote for the amendment and affirm an equivalence between homosexuality and pedophilia that has to be specifically separated in legislation, or vote against the amendment and have the wingnut media morons saying you protected pedophiles. Are they morons? Or do they just bear false witness in the hope that morons will believe them?
I completely agree with you on the pedophilia crap. That is why I am no longer a Republican.
Strange but true.
And love the winking insinuation that gay=pedophile (thoroughly debunked). They need some new material.
Joey, did you see Joe the Pretend PLumber's latest public clown show? He mentions that he has gay friends, and they understand that he keeps them away from his children. This is thie thinking of today's GOP.
I won't mention the Angels if you don't mention the Yanks. Ha!
This amendment wasn't necessary. Pedophiles are already not protected. Hannity is just trying to enflame the dumb asses that don't know any better than to get their "news" from him.
Hey maybe someday someone will haul this guy into court. Now that would be priceless :-)
If pedophiles are already not protected, then explicitly stating it in the bill does no harm. If that is the case, why would anyone object to having it stated explicitly?
We've seen the same obsfucation delivered by Obama in pretending he didn't vote against the "baby born alive act". It is all an act to deceive.
Baldwin's stated her real motive for objecting to this common sense amendment. She did not want to offend gays. My guess is because she thinks the law could then be used to accuse her of a hate crime.
Really? That is really how your thought process works for how our elected officials should be working? If we can attach an ammendment to every law stating explicitly that pedophiles are not included we should do this? Are you serious?
"We've seen the same obsfucation delivered by Obama in pretending he didn't vote against the "baby born alive act". It is all an act to deceive."
So, you believe that Obama and the Democrats actually want to protect pedophiles and that including an ammendment to each and every bill explicitly excluding pedophiles is "common sense"? I'm not sure you should be in the conversation with the adults then.
What did Baldwin mean by this in reacting to King's proposed amendment, ...Baldwin said that it "is unnecessary and, I would add, inflammatory in terms of insinuations."
Who is she trying to protect from "inflammatory" insinuations?
ps. You are presenting a straw man argument. I never said to exclude pedophiles in every bill.
However, I do not believe you should make thoughts a crime as 'hate' legislation attempts to do.
The amendment was trying to smear gay people by falsely suggesting pedophilia is an orientation.
Come on, we are trying to have an educated, rational, adult discussion about a serious topic. Something that I happen to find fun and educational. Please take part in it as an adult or, you know....DON'T.
Where's the part about veterans? Was there something else being enacted or discussed in Congress that pertained to protecting veterans, and the Democrats voted it down? If not, how does Fox get to make it up?
Also, if you're in the mood for a good laugh, go ahead and follow the link given below the picture of "House Democrats Defend Pedophiles Over Veterans"; the comments are hilarious. Or they would be, except that there are screaming hordes of people who actually think that way.
But post a comment like this on Fox Nation and you won't get a response of anykind from the herd of people who post there. Not one single reponse to this message. But try to point out the inaccuracies of Fox reporting on this issue and you are accused of hating the troops and sleeping with your children.
But by all means, don't leave your positions to yourself. Without winguts to laugh at, this site would be no fun.
I used to get jumped when I was a kid walking home from school because I was a white kid in a black neighborhood. But, really, they were just bullies who happened to be black and saw a chance to beat up a kid who was different than them.
We don't need "special" laws for this. Our legal system should alreay be equipped to handle such things. If the penalties are not harsh enough, then increase them. Do not have different penalties because this guy was killed because he was an Arab which is somehow worse than this guy who was killed because he was a postman (or whatever). Who cares? Punish the acts.
Or to put it another way: "Oh, crud. My argument is indeed unsophisticated. I will deflect this by pretending there's a big difference between intent and thought. I'll add 'obviously' to make sure no one really thinks hard about it. I will also pretend that the guy who pointed out that my argument was unsophisticated was 'boasting' about himself."
More, please, right ON. I can't wait for your third-tier cleverness.
RO, do you think there should be a distinction between first degree murder and manslaughter?
(This same question could be directed at FishergirlUSMC, but somehow I think you're a slightly more likely candidate to get something out of it)
However, if someone kills another person on purpose I do not care whether they planned it out or it was in the heat of the moment. "Passion" does not justify it for me in anyway. If your impulse control is so poor that you could not help but get so angry as to kill another citizen, then you are a danger to the rest of us and I think for the good of society you should be locked up.
I will never understand how people who plan the killing get life, while people who kill in the heat of passion get less than a decade behind bars sometimes. What are the chances this person may get angry again? Somehow it's not as bad if you killed someone because you were angry rather than in "cold blood". I think if either way you may have an issue with cold blood if you consider killing someone an option when you are angry.
So murder and manslaughter are no different, troll?
And I don't understand what you are trying to convey in the above post.
-I would say a hate crime is premeditated (fill in the crime).
I don't care if they attacked me because I am gay or because I am black, or because I am wearing a short skirt. I only care that the assailant is caught and prosecuted for the crime he committed.
But the law does care. That's the way it is, but wingnuts want to have an exception for gay people.
But, once again, the attempt to bring pedophilia into the argument by the far right is disgusting and another example of the worst of politics. It is also why the Republicans are down below 25% in this country.
So you disagree with leniency in the case of crimes of passion? Because those cases do exactly what you are against above, and have been part of the judicial system for years.
I understand that I tend to be a results oriented person and sometimes cannot see the nuance where necessary and that there are thoughtful, intelligent, people on the other side of this argument. I just think there is a lot of time spent trying to figure out motive on the punishment for an individual and I do not see the importance. I do understand that the intent of the perpetrator is important. I just do not care so much as why the perpetrator decided to become a perp and make a victim.
However, "thinking" about killing someone is not a crime. If you have never ever "thought" about committing a crime then maybe I am crazy. I have "thought" about doing a lot of things that are crimes. I just DON'T DO THEM.
I understand that the law has taken into consideration crimes of passion differently than premeditated murder. I am not suggesting to law does not. I just happen not to agree with that aspect of the law.
I think we spend too much time on thought and not enough time on punishing the actions. I also believe that this is what leads to such short prison sentences for lesser degrees of murder. Meanwhile, our non-violent drug offenders are given mandatory minimums.
I think prisons are for those that have proven themselves to be dangerous to society. Once you knowingly, purposefully kill another citizen you forfeit your right to be a member of our society. I don't care if you did it to rob them or because you are afraid to admit you want to kiss boys. It's all the same to me.
Because I hurt your feelings before I killed you?
Hey I'm with you, killing that is both willful and premeditated is killing, no matter what the motivation.
And if you are really arguing that we should not go by intent, then why make all of the anti terrorism laws after 9-11? I mean, who cares if the guys flying the planes into buildings were doing it to cause terror or inflict damage on the entire United States? They killed people so it was murder and nothing more, right? Right? No it wasn't and no one would say it was. It was an act of terror against a group of people (the US). Stop pretending that the intent or "thought" is what is hanging you up.
I do not think that police officers, federal agents, or elected officals, or any other citizens should be treated special when they are victims. They are not any better or any worse than the rest of us. The punishment should be harsh no matter who you attack.
We absolutely should NOT make laws in reaction to a specific incident. The Patriot Act is exactly the wrong thing to do. Reactionary law is based on fear and is almost always a bad idea.
As for the terrorists on 9/11 - it was mass murder and should be treated as such. Anyone who kills thousands of people should be treated as such. As far as their punishment goes, I don't care if they did it in the spur of the moment or they planned it out. Do you actually believe that if someone is a mass murderer, but they didn't plan it out - it was not in cold blood, and they just blew their lid and started shooting people that they are somehow less dangerous? I just don't see it.
Southern trees bear strange fruit
Blood on the leaves
Blood at the root
Black bodies swinging in the southern breeze
Strange fruit hanging from the poplar trees
Pastoral scene of the gallant south
The bulging eyes and the twisted mouth
The scent of magnolia sweet and fresh
Then the sudden smell of burning flesh
Here is a fruit for the crows to pluck
for the rain to gather
for the wind to suck
for the sun to rot
for the tree to drop
Here is a strange and bitter crop
If there was one or two it wasn't specifically because they were white. But the black bodies were specifically because they were black. The sheer number alone, and also the visciousness of the crimes, should convince you that hate crimes target groups specifically with the intent to intimidate. And that specific language in the law should be mandated to deal with that.
...but not well enough to spellcheck her name.
But since these clowns are allowed to LEGALLY LIE I can only say...
Typical... and quite expected!
It's amazing our media has descended to this level. An open forum for outright smears of progressives.
Our nation has become very degraded by this Fox News crap.
If you spend your whole lives talking about Fox news, rush, beck and the rest, all you are doing is keeping them relevant.
There is no doubt in my mind that the world outside america (yes there actually is one) is much more positive towards america since the war, oil and god loving government has been removed. Stop trying to change the minds of the ignorant because it is not going to happen. Go outside and ride a bike or kick a footy with your children, it is far more rewarding.
From my understanding of the bill, what the democrats added was that if someone commits a crime against you because you are a pedophile, you are not protected under the hate crime statute because sexual orientation doesn't include pedophilis since it is not a consensual act.
For the military part, the bill says that if you commit a hate crime and you are in the military, you are subject to the same laws as anyone else.
So where is the problem? Why were the democrats wrong in excluding hate crime status towards pedophile and keeping military personel accountable. I don't get it.
Not according to this law, which only protects the straight and gay sexual orientations. Instead, pedophiles will only be protected from crimes, not hate crimes.
Given the government publishes the names and address for any would-be vigilante to look up, and since an assault on them is still a crime, and also considering these lists also expose innocent family members and bystanders to these assaults, it is unreasonable to exclude them from this bill.
Every American is entitled to equal protection of the law...it's in the Constitution. But then members of congress don't really pay much attention to that document these days.
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