Economist Laffer on CNN: "[J]ust wait till you see Medicare, Medicaid ... done by the government"
August 04, 2009 11:54 am ET
From the 10 a.m. hour of CNN Newsroom on August 4:
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By the way, we tried 'supply side' economics for about 30 years, and proved successfully that you know very little about economics in the real world. It was a dismal failure, and led directly to the problems we are now having.
Go back to practicing voodoo economics, sir, and don't come meddling in the health coverage debate by spouting Luntz's talking points, okay?
No Washington bureaucrat or healthcare lobbyist should stand between your family and your doctor.
Decisions about my healthcare should be between me and my doctor and no one else
and on and on.
I am going to every town hall meeting in my area with a copy of this drivel and count the number of references to it, then ask "Can you please discuss this topic in your own words, not Frank Luntz's?"
(Aside from the fact that they live and on the very small vote of the very rich and the very large vote of the very stupid.)
...was the Crap News Network's treatment of this story. They never once mentioned how the Grass Roots SS (screamers/shouters) are part of a sham orchestrated by serial liar Dick Armey and his vault full of health industry hit money.
The Most Trusted Name in News.
Riiight.
The amount of ignorance and stupidity in this country is beyond embarrassing. The fact that CNN gave this moron ANY time in front of the camera is all the proof I need that today's media is an absolute abomination.
Walter Cronkite must be spinning wildly in his tomb.
I mean, seriously, what are the owners thinking?
There is also no truth in advertising. Comcast signed me up for a flat monthly rate a year ago or so, and I have since lost four channels, but my bill remains the same! Maybe I will call them today...
I found just having cable was a much more cost-effective source of affirmation.
Intruder Alert.. Intruder Alert...
*Whew!* Well, thanks for reading. Next update in 20...
Good God, not only is Laughingstock a shill, he doesn't even try to hide the fact that he's simply spewing talking points.
The simple fact is that without health care reform this country is in huge trouble. The health care industry and the bought and paid for politicians know it, but they care more about profits than the fate of our country.
These people will only get their way if we let them. I'm so sick and tired of the monied minority dictating to the vast majority.
But then, that would be actual journalism.
I have heard tales of such a thing, but I don't believe it actually exists...
70 cents on the dollar goes to pay claims, RD, and innovation. The other 30 cents goes into the pockets of execs, and to buy politicians.
Innovation and technology are not dependent on the Health Insurance industry's profits. Private funding and and gov't funded research do just fine.
So much profits that their CEOs get nice multi-million dollar salaries and pay doctors whatever it takes to erase their conscience in order to declare those life hitech medical technologies "experimental" and not covered in your insurance plan.
If we had such great medical technology, R&D, why is our health care ranked 37th in the world... just above Slovenia and just below Costa Rica.
Why are we the only industrialized nation in the world that doesn't have a national health care system... are we that incapable? Is the rest of world better than us?
With all that technology, we currently rank below Costra Rica in health outcomes (life expectancy, infant mortality, etc.). So we pay twice as much as anyone else for our "good" health care, but we are less healthy than those who get "subpar" free health care.
To make this a sports analogy, it would be like if the Cincinnati Bengals had twice the payroll of the Pittsburgh Steelers. Then, when the Bengals said "hey, you know, we're paying twice as much in salary as the Steelers and they're winning Super Bowls and we're going 5-11, let's do what they're doing," outraged front office personnel said "Ya, sure, run you're team like the Steelers, then you'll end up with a subpar offensive line, just like they do." And the fans agreed to keep paying double the ticket prices because they fear having a subpar offensive line, ignoring that despite they Steelers subpar offensive line, they are infinitely better than the Bengals.
It just makes no sense.
Are you saying that I don't deserve the same health care opportunities as our troops and our seniors? Are you saying that the military health care is not up to par?
Please elaborate.
The medical treatment that our senior citizens are receiving will not be able to sustain itself much longer because the inefficiency of the government to manage the finances and one of the biggest complaints among soldiers is the lack of medical care. Therefore if you want that then you deserve it.
As far as the WHO rankings of healthcare you need to read the fine print. They have ranked the US as the highest in "Responsiveness". We were downgraded because we rank 55th in "fairest mechanism for health system finance". Therefore I will not argue that we dont have problems with the cost of healthcare but this is largely due to the cost of malpractice insurance in this country. You can thank the Dems who have the trial lawyer lobbyist in their pockets.
As far as mortality goes, well we are the most glutenous society in the world. Eating cheese burgers from McD's all week doesnt lend itself to a healthy society but that is our perogative. We love our donuts, beer, and smokes! We may not have the best mortality ratings but that isnt due to the quality of our healthcare but has to do more with the way we live our lives.
I dont need forced healthcare from the government and I dont need to follow other countries like lemmings. Just ask Breast Cancer patients in Canada how they like their healthcare.
"The medical treatment that our senior citizens are receiving will not be able to sustain itself much longer because the inefficiency of the government to manage the finances..."
Clearly it never occurred to you to see if private insurance is sustainable. Their costs are rising much faster than medicare. And they are by nature FAR more beuracratic than the government, because they need massive beuracracies dedicated to finding ways to deny coverage. What we have is a health care crisis, not a medicare crisis.
"Therefore I will not argue that we dont have problems with the cost of healthcare but this is largely due to the cost of malpractice insurance in this country".
Malpractice rewards, in settlements and court rulings, add up to about 3.6 billion dollars annually out of the 2 trillion we currently spend on health care, thats %.18 of healthcare spending. And there is no evidence that stricter tort laws drive up healthcare costs over all.
"I dont need forced healthcare from the government and I dont need to follow other countries like lemmings. Just ask Breast Cancer patients in Canada how they like their healthcare"
The drones just love to point out small imperfections of other countrie's healthcare. Why dont you ask a poor person with breast cancer how they like the American system? A system where 18000 people die because of lack of health insurance every year. Where 63% of bankruptcies are directly related to health care costs. Where insurance premiums rise three times faster than wages. We have two choices; we can ration healthcare on the basis of need, like the canadians, or we keep rationing on the ability to pay.
Healthcare for all is patriotic, it is at the core of government's moral mission to protect and empower her citizens. Getting a public option is about the fundamental American principle of empathy. It is because of empathy that we enshrined in our founding documents freedom and fairness for all, not just the powerful.
Okay, not knowing that Medicare and Medicaid is a government program, aside...
What is with the demonizing of government agencies.
Our Military, FBI, and CIA are the best run agencies in the world, but the DMV and Post Office are horrible? Do you know anyone on Social Security? Have you ever heard of them not getting their checks on time?
I don't know what the DMV is like in other states, but in California, I can do almost all of my renewals over the internet (registration renewals, license renewals). I haven't actually had to go to the DMV in several years, but the last time I did, I made an appointment and was in and out in 30 minutes to get a lost DL replaced.
As far as the post office, I get my mail everyday and I don't ever worry about my bills not reaching their destination for $0.44.
I had to ask my bank to change a direct deposit from my employer, and it took 3 months and endless phone calls... and don't get me started on my cell phone billing problems!
Now back to Laffer... if he really has any Associates, they must all be hanging their head in shame.
And shame on you CNN moderator for not correcting him. There isn't enough of that happening when these talking heads get to say whatever the hell they want.
The DMV in any state can cause delays when overwhelmed with applications but what is the big deal? You wait in line at McDonald's and then they leave something out. Should we change the McDonalds' business structure or just close them down for not upsizing to a biggie fries? And this guy is an economist. I still wonder when they bring on two economists who disagree and one is proven wrong does he lose his EXPERT degree? Any which college hands out those expert degrees?
I am now a firm believer that the Republican Party is run by American Terrorists who will do anything including tearing this country apart because they don't have things thier way. These haters should be exposed for what they really are..American Terrorists. Then let the people decide. But how do you erase the clouds of paranoia dispersed throughtout the RightWing?? Why not call thier bluff and pull out the Nuclear Option and vote....
There's a reason each military branch and the Pentagon has their own intelligence branch and that Bush installed an intelligence czar. Maybe they're the "best" clandestine agency but I doubt it. The US intelligence community needs a complete overhaul - both to increase overall data collection and analysis capacity of foreign and domestic threats coupled with far more transparency and much tighter control on how said information may be used.
Like blueline99, I have only gone to the DMV (or, locally MVD) once in the last decade, and that because my license was over 12 years old, so they wanted an updated photo (w/o my glasses, oddly enough). Took about half an hour from entry to walking out.
Also, aren't Neocons also supposedly FOR "states"? But they don't think their wonderful state governments, more responsive to da peeple, are all that wonderful when
1) they are needed to make all government look bad
2) the official documents aren't what they want (birthers)
As far as the post office, I get my mail everyday and I don't ever worry about my bills not reaching their destination for $0.44.
Excellent point; I thought the same thing when I read that ridiculous fool Laffer's statement. I've always found the Post Office to be efficient and well-run, and I've lived all over the country. Ditto for (gulp!) the IRS; the few times I've had to deal with them the customer service has been terrific. My cable and Internet company (Comcast), on the other hand, is appalling; trying to get an actual person on the line is all but impossible. I'm cancelling cable at the end of the month; seeing as how CNN continues to have idiots on like this only makes me happier with that decision.
The support is awful and frustrating...as I get angry dealing with them I can't help but think of the thousands of jobs that were lost here. How is it that we let these companies make more profit from moving these jobs offshore!
Sorry, had to fix that first post. It was atrocious to read.
think he`s suppose to be a economist shaking my head no wonder noting ever add up to them.
1) Its been proven over and over again that a market in healthcare effectively does not exist
2) Medicare and Medicaid are both run by the government.
Laffer's argument is essentially the standard rhetoric about markets, regardless of the topic at hand
I assure you that it is perfectly legal and proper for people to disagree with the party in power. You folks did it all the time when the situation was reversed. I have to tell you that with tax revenues dropping like a rock, due to rising unemployment and despite the stimulus package, the concept of raising taxes to support all the unfunded mandates in the 1017 pages of House Health Care Bill is not an encouraging word. Of course no one is talking about raising taxes either...right?
This wingnut talking point needs some adjustment.
And just imagine if there was no USPS. How much would we be paying UPS or FedEx to mail our letters?
These cons are idiots.
LET'S HEAR YOUR IDEAS ON BRINGING HEALTHCARE TO ALL AMERICANS YOU STUPID RIGHTWING CORPORATE FASCISTS!
Oh that's right, you don't have any ideas besides the same old ignorant tax cut and deregulation trash you've been spewing for decades.
Lesson: Don't say, "I'm not sure where you're getting that." Instead ask: "Where are you getting that?"
Guys, this is just a mechanism to get from here to there (single payer). Let me assure you, and I say this as an insider, Physicians have had about all their going to take of Government funded medicine. Last year we moved our office 1 block from the site we've occupied for >20 years. It took 9 months for Medicare to acknowledge our new address, during which they made no payments for the services our group provided seniors. When they finally did make the change the funds were paid, without interest or explanation. There were ~15 inches of documents back and forth over this time. ONLY Medicare gave us problems, private insurers required a single form...
by blueline99 (August 04, 2009 3:25 pm ET)
"Reminds me of all the companies that have outsourced their customer support to India...The support is awful and frustrating...as I get angry dealing with them I can't help but think of the thousands of jobs that were lost here. How is it that we let these companies make more profit from moving these jobs offshore!"
roundhouse (August 04, 2009 10:14 pm ET)
"Yay! Corporate profits!"
So here is the the problem. Blueline is outraged that companies are getting profits by off shore sourcing. Roundhouse is being sarcastic.
What, may I ask, is wrong with making a profit? If I can't make enough to pay the bills and have enough left to live on and reinvest in the business, then why would I work?
This is the same problem that liberals seem to have with insurance companies. "Oh dear! They might make a profit!" If the insurance companies don't have a large available cash reserve with which to pay claims, I would not want to be insured by them. If they run out of money I don't get reimbursed.
This is exactly what happened in Florida. There was private hurricane insurance. The state got into the hurricane insurance business. Dropped the premiums so that everyone went for the state insurance and forced the private companies to stop selling hurricane insurance. Now the state is the only provider. Yes, it is a single payer system, as far as hurricane insurance in Florida is concerned, and the state has insufficient funds to cover the next major hurricane. So to pay claims when it happens they will have to borrow into an ever increasing deficit or raise taxes, when there would have been private money enough to cover the claims if they had left private insurers alone.
Profit is not an evil thing people. It pays bills, employs workers and covers insurance claims, something that a tax and spend government will find increasingly hard to do.