About us Login Get email updates
Jamison Foser
Print

How Time magazine enables Glenn Beck's lies

September 17, 2009 4:17 pm ET

Four years ago, Time magazine devoted its cover story to a puff-piece profile of Ann Coulter, the right-wing ideologue best known for serial lies and wishing death upon those she disagrees with (journalists included). Only, Time forgot about the lies and the bloodlust and portrayed Coulter in a remarkably kind light.

Now, it's Glenn Beck's turn.

In its new issue, Time features a cover profile of the Fox demagogue, written by David Von Drehle -- a profile that downplays or ignores Beck's defining qualities, draws false equivalencies between liberals and conservatives, portrays obvious lies as simple differences of perspective, and omits Beck's most shocking and outrageous statements.

In the opening paragraph, Time describes last weekend's Beck-organized, right-wing temper tantrum in Washington, in which conservative activists got together to air a disparate array of sometimes contradictory grievances. Here's how it dealt with the size of the crowd, right in the first paragraph:

If you get your information from liberal sources, the crowd numbered about 70,000, many of them greedy racists. If you get your information from conservative sources, the crowd was hundreds of thousands strong, perhaps as many as a million, and the tenor was peaceful and patriotic.

But here's what Time left out: Those conservative sources are flat-out lying.

Progressive media critics often point out that the media too frequently take a "he-said/she-said" approach to politics that boils down to, "Is the Earth flat or spherical? Opinions differ." That may seem like an exaggeration, but Time's handling of the crowd size dispute is virtually indistinguishable from that caricature.

Actually, in some ways, it's less honest than the caricature. See, the 70,000 estimate didn't come from "liberal sources"; it came from sane sources, such as the Washington, D.C., Fire Department. Time portrayed the disparate estimates as equally-likely-to-be-true products of ideological observers. In fact, the large estimates from conservatives were clearly false, and the lower, accurate estimates came from official, nonpartisan observers -- and even from some conservatives like Beck's colleagues at Fox News.

And the estimates of "as many as a million"? True, they came from conservatives (actually, some conservatives put the crowd size at the 2 million mark. Time has downplayed the dishonesty displayed by one of the very conservatives it later references.) But, more accurately, they came from dishonest conservatives who were lying, lying about how many people were there, lying about where the estimates came from. Lying.

Look: The difference between 70,000 people on the National Mall for a protest and 2 million is huge. Seventy thousand people is a good-sized crowd. It's nothing to be ashamed of. It's almost as many as the 85,000 people who attended last Saturday's college football game in Lincoln, Nebraska. But 2 million people? There probably weren't 2 million people in the entire state of Nebraska (population: 1.8 million) last Saturday.

Houston, Texas, is the fourth-largest city in America, with just over 2 million residents. Do you know what happens when you drop the population of Houston, Texas, in the middle of Washington, D.C.? Hotels for miles and miles around are booked far in advance. The Metro system is stretched to the breaking point. Thousands of people get trapped in tunnels. It is, in short, unmistakably different from what happens when Missouri plays Bowling Green.

I dwell on this because the difference between 70,000 and 2 million people is simply not something about which reasonable people of honest motives can disagree. It is not something that can be an innocent mistake. Dishonest people who wanted to misinform you told lies in order to exaggerate the crowd size. There really can be no doubt about that.

But Time not only won't make clear that they are lying, it won't even tell you that they were wrong. Thus, the magazine makes clear right up front that this article is not "journalism"; it is a pathetic attempt to pander to malicious liars.

Here, look at Time's next paragraph:

At any rate, what we can say with confidence is that Deanna Frankowski was there. A cheery woman of 49 from Leeds, Ala., Frankowski said she had come to Washington as part of a group of 100 or more protesters. They filled two buses.

Well, no. What we can say with confidence is that nowhere near 2 million, or 1 million, or 500,000 people were there, and anyone who says otherwise is either lying or has fallen prey to those who are lying. One of many ways we know this is the case is that if it took two buses to get 100 protesters into the city, it would take 40,000 buses to get 2 million there. Anyone see any evidence of 40,000 buses (or their plane, train, and automobile equivalents) last weekend? Yeah, I didn't think so.

Time continued:

The old American mind-set that Richard Hofstadter famously called "the paranoid style" - the sense that Masons or the railroads or the Pope or the guys in black helicopters are in league to destroy the country - is aflame again, fanned from both right and left. Between the liberal fantasies about Brownshirts at town halls and the conservative concoctions of brainwashed children goose-stepping to school, you'd think the Palm in Washington had been replaced with a Munich beer hall.

What in the world is Time talking about? This is a grotesque false equivalence. Conservatives have been yelling about President Obama being a secret Kenyan bent on sending granny to the Death Panel, comparing him to Hitler and Mao and Stalin and who-knows-who-else -- and that, apparently, is matched in intensity and paranoia by liberals pointing out this unhinged behavior? Insane.

Eventually, Time got to its point: Glenn Beck. But even there, Time buried the lede. No, that's not quite right. Actually, Time completely omitted the lede.

See, Glenn Beck's defining characteristic is that he's deeply dishonest. He claimed that 1.7 million people stormed the National Mall last week to protest Obama. And that's just one example; Beck tells lies of such size and obviousness, and with such frequency, that to fail to make his dishonesty clear right up front is, itself, dishonest. But Time didn't even hint at it in its introduction of Beck:

Glenn Beck: the pudgy, buzz-cut, weeping phenomenon of radio, TV and books. ... Beck is 45, tireless, funny, self-deprecating, a recovering alcoholic, a convert to Mormonism, a libertarian and living with ADHD.

Indeed, the closest the Time article ever came -- ever -- to indicating that Beck tells lies and spreads falsehoods is this whopper of an understatement: "[H]e also spins yarns of less substance." Oh, snap! That really exposes him for the fraud that he is!

Instead, Time suggested Beck's rants are reality-based [emphasis added]:

Beck mines the timeless theme of the corrupt Them thwarting a virtuous Us. This flexible narrative often contains genuinely uncomfortable truths. Some days "they" are the unconfirmed policy "czars" whom Beck fears Obama is using to subvert constitutional government - and he has some radical-sounding sound bites to back it up. Some days "they" are the network of leftist community organizers known as ACORN - and his indictment of the group is looking stronger every day.

Well, not every day. See, on Tuesday, Beck aired a video of an ACORN worker saying she had killed her ex-husband and then went on a prolonged rant about ACORN employing someone who was guilty of "premeditated murder." Turns out that wasn't quite true. She didn't murder her ex-husband. Nobody murdered her ex-husband. Her ex-husbands are quite alive and well.

That's typical Beck: He rushes to make sensational allegations based on the thinnest of evidence, without bothering to check it out. It's behavior that careens from reckless to dishonest, and it's his calling card. But, to Time, Beck's treatment of ACORN is something to be applauded. It's looking stronger every day (as long as you ignore the fact that he just aired a bogus video in order to falsely suggest an ACORN worker is a murderer)!

It isn't just Beck's dishonesty that got left on the cutting-room floor. It's the extent of his offensiveness. Take a look at Time's portrayal of Beck's emotional recollection of the September 11 terrorist attacks:

On the recent anniversary of the 9/11 attacks, Beck grew afraid that Americans may no longer be the sort of people who cross mountain ranges in covered wagons and toss hot rivets around in bold bursts of skyscraper-building. Tears came to his eyes (they often do) as he voiced this last fear. But then he remembered that the fiber of ordinary Americans is the one thing Glenn Beck need never fear. So he squared his quivering chin to the camera and held up a snapshot of ground zero, still empty eight long years after the World Trade Center was destroyed.

It goes on like that for a while. But one thing Time didn't mention? This famous Glenn Beck statement: "You know it took me about a year to start hating the 9-11 victims' families? Took me about a year."

Seems like if you're going to devote two full paragraphs to Glenn Beck's tearful remembrance of September 11, maybe you should note the contempt -- hatred, even -- he has expressed for the families of the people who died that day. Doesn't it?

Nor did Time mention Beck's 2001 statement that he'd like to "beat" Rep. Charlie Rangel "to death with a shovel"; his comments about poisoning Nancy Pelosi; his comparison of the Holocaust museum shooter to Thomas Jefferson; this little outburst; or his comparisons of Obama to Adolf Hitler. Let's stop there for a second and go back to Time's opening lines:

On Sept. 12, a large crowd gathered in Washington to protest ... what? The goals of Congress and the Obama Administration, mainly - the cost, the scale, the perceived leftist intent. The crowd's agenda was wide-ranging, so it's hard to be more specific. "End the Fed," a sign read. A schoolboy's placard denounced "Obama's Nazi Youth Militia." Another poster declared, "We the People for Capitalism Not Socialism."

Gee, where did that "Obama's Nazi Youth Militia" garbage come from? It came from Glenn Beck. But Time won't tell you that.

After whitewashing Beck's dishonesty and borderline-obscene behavior for a while, the magazine returned to the crowd estimates:

We're in a flood stage, and who's to blame? The answer is like the estimates of the size of the crowd in Washington: Whom do you trust? Either the corrupt, communist-loving traitors on the left are causing this, or it's the racist, greedy warmongers on the right, or maybe the dishonest, incompetent, conniving media, which refuse to tell the truth about whomever you personally happen to despise.

At this point, you have to wonder if the article was some kind of performance art, designed to prove the very skepticism about the media it seems to lament. See, this very Time article was the product of a "dishonest, incompetent, conniving media, which refuse to tell the truth." And not because I happen to despise Glenn Beck, but because there simply were not 1.7 million people at last week's protest. Because Time damn well knows there were not 1.7 million people at last week's protest. And because Time refused to say there were not 1.7 million people there. Not only that -- Time also insisted on pretending that only "liberal sources" say there were 70,000 people there, when, in fact, the D.C. Fire Department said there were 70,000 people. That's a dishonest and incompetent refusal to tell the truth. Actually, it's worse than a refusal to tell the truth: It's a dishonest and incompetent false claim.

At the beginning of his article, Von Drehle referred to a recent poll that found "record-low levels of public trust of the mainstream media." Guess what? Articles like this are why nobody trusts the media. When you pretend that obviously false claims about crowd sizes are valid, people won't trust you. When you pretend that only liberals say 70,000 people actually attended last week's protest, people won't trust you. They shouldn't trust you. You aren't trustworthy. You are doing your job dishonestly and incompetently.

And that dishonesty, that incompetence, is what enables Glenn Beck. When Glenn Beck says 1.7 million people were at the protest, and the Washington, D.C., Fire Department says 70,000, and Time runs an article saying conservatives and liberals disagree about the crowd size, that enables Glenn Beck's lies.

No wonder Beck liked the article so much.

Jamison Foser is a Senior Fellow at Media Matters for America, a progressive media watchdog and research and information center based in Washington, D.C. Foser also contributes to County Fair, a media blog featuring links to progressive media criticism from around the Web as well as original commentary. You can follow him on Twitter and Facebook or sign up to receive his columns by email.

Expand All Expand 1st Level Collapse All Add Comment
    • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 4:47 pm ET)
      6 25
      Conservatives have been yelling about President Obama being a secret Kenyan bent on sending granny to the Death Panel, comparing him to Hitler and Mao and Stalin and who-knows-who-else -


      This is a flat out lie, and dishonest in every redard. And here is what MMFA will never admit, and never acknowledge. A very few conservatives have compared Obama to Hitler, and a very few think he is trying to kill grandma. To make the implication that all conservatives, or even most feel this way is what will always keep MMFA a fringe far left outfit reporting on those in the fringe far right.

      MMFA will never accept that you can oppose the policies Obama stands for, and not be a racist or think Obama is Hitler.

      If MMFA were able to remove Hitler from the English language, a good number of MMFA posters, snoopy, the Col, Harely...(or Dr. Matt as he likes to call himself now) WZ, vhw, Easy to refute, etc etc would never be able to post again.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 4:52 pm ET)
        14 2
        and you will always be relegated to the delusional reality challenged fringe.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 4:57 pm ET)
          2 16
          With all your wisdom, why dont you lead the Boycott against Time magazine. You can see how much it has hurt Beck...bigger audience, cover of a major magazine...think of what you could do to Time.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 5:00 pm ET)
            9 1
            Truth hurts doesn't it!
            Report Abuse
          • Author by New Frontier (September 17, 2009 5:11 pm ET)
            13 1
            see how much [a boycott] has hurt Beck.

            60 major advertisers have left Beck's show. That is not a "boycott". They have fled the scene-probably forever.
            Report Abuse
      • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 4:58 pm ET)
        16 1
        Oh a thumbs down! POV face the fact your party is the fringe!

        58 percent of GOP not sure/doubt Obama born in US

        Shocker poll from Kos/Research2000 today.

        A whopping 58 percent of Republicans either think Barack Obama wasn't born in the US (28 percent) or aren't sure (30 percent). A mere 42 percent think he was.

        That means a majority of Republicans polled either don't know about -- or don't believe the seemingly incontrovertible evidence Obama's camp has presented over and over and over that he was born in Hawaii in '61.

        It also explains why Republicans, including Roy Blunt, are playing footsie with the Birther fringe.

        Surprise, surprise: Birther sentiment was strongest in the South and among the 60-plus crowd - presumably because seniors can't log on to the Internet and rely on rumor, word of mouth and right-wing talk radio.

        When do we start a serious dialog about the Birther movement being a proxy for racism that is unacceptable to articulate in more direct terms?

        In all 77 percent of Americans overall think the president is actually an American.

        Research 2000 for Daily Kos. 7/27-30. All adults. MoE 2% (No trend lines)

        Do you believe that Barack Obama was born in the United States of America or not?

        Yes 77
        No 11
        Not sure 12

        How do those numbers break down?

        Yes No Not sure
        Dem 93 4 3
        Rep 42 28 30
        Ind 83 8 9

        Northeast 93 4 3
        South 47 23 30
        Midwest 90 6 4
        West 87 7 6

        18-29 88 4 8
        30-44 72 14 14
        45-59 82 8 10
        60+ 69 17 14



        By Glenn Thrush 08:14 AM

        Report Abuse
        • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 5:01 pm ET)
          4 17
          Wow..an unbiased source. The dailyKos. You are kidding right??
          Report Abuse
          • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 5:05 pm ET)
            13 1
            The questions are simple enough! But you continue to deny, like I said your party is the fringe and you represent it well.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by electricgrendel (September 17, 2009 10:29 pm ET)
               
            Wow. I'm not sure which is more offensive: your obvious desire to paint your opponents as ideologues, or your unwillingness to realize that you belong to a party comprised only of ideologues.

            DailyKos did not perform that poll. They did not make all of the phone calls, do the math themselves, etc. They hired the nonpartisan Research 2000 to do so. I know it's hard for a hack such as yourself to wrap your mind around this, but just because your side is completely incapable of ever doing anything without the taint of ideology and partisanship does not mean the left suffers the same affliction.

            We actually care about things like the truth, results and the like. We don't worry about shopping around for polls like Rasmussen to prop up our desperate senses of self.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by jjcomet514 (September 18, 2009 9:33 am ET)
            9 1
            The polling source is Research 2000, dumba--, NOT Daily Kos. Your reading comprehension skills are clearly as poor as your rational thinking skills. Can conservatives become any stupider? I'd like to think not, but POV hits a new low each time he posts...
            Report Abuse
            • Author by all your eyes (September 18, 2009 10:22 am ET)
              6 1
              It either requires that you be stupid, or willfully suspend reality, in order to believe the tripe being passed around the right wing like chewed gum at a teenage spin the bottle party. I find that Republicans who have maintained their intellectual honesty either support Obama, or at least support parts of his agenda, and most of them won't vote Republican again in the near future. Sadly, that's a small minority of conservatives in this country.
              Report Abuse
          • Author by tgarcia6327 (September 18, 2009 1:34 pm ET)
               
            How about these figures, which didn't come from the LIBRAL MEDIA, In fact they came from CBS/TIME. 70% of FOX cable viewers thought that Iraq had something to do with 9/11. Gee, I wonder why these viewers of THIS cable station and and no other thought this. Also, that Saddam Hussein had a relationship with Al-Qaeda. Both of these statements are the furthest from the truth,and was found to be false. But why would these viewers more then any other viewers of any other news organization think this way? Because, FOX has been broadcasting 24/7 that these two statements were TRUE! That's exactly what's happening again. And if the MSM would get off their fat asses and do some research and find the truth they could finally TELL THE TRUTH!! But that’s NOT what they want, because that doesn’t create ratings, which equals MONEY!
            Report Abuse
          • Author by pete592 (September 18, 2009 4:00 pm ET)
            4  
            At least he cited a source, unlike you.
            Report Abuse
        • Author by oscar the grouch (September 17, 2009 8:04 pm ET)
          4 3
          Let's see, registered R = about 32% of the voting population, 58% of 32% = 18%,(doesn't agree with numbers above) significant amount of foil cap wearers, but how close to the foil cap wearers on the other end of the political spectrum, in total numbers? And it looks as though the major part of the 18% live in the South. And as usual, it will be the independents that determine the outcome of the next election.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 8:23 pm ET)
            9 1
            Maybe, and as long as the fringe continues to control the Republican Party they will continue to loose elections.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by oscar the grouch (September 18, 2009 12:28 am ET)
              3  
              That is true. I warned my boss (previous job) several years ago when he came out backing a State Governor's candidate that I felt was too far to the right on some major issues. He blew me off, but the State has not had a R governor since.
              Report Abuse
              • Author by NewBee (September 18, 2009 3:19 am ET)
                3  
                He blew me off, but the State has not had a R governor since.
                Thank goodness. I thought this last election, Gregoire might be vulnerable but it turned out to not even be close. Now, if we can get rid of the last Republican Congressman representing Western Washington, I'd be satisfied.
                Report Abuse
                • Author by oscar the grouch (September 19, 2009 11:06 am ET)
                  1  
                  And if the state were split down the crest of the Cascades, others would be satisfied. Too bad we all can't go through life being satisfied all the time.
                  Report Abuse
        • Author by bradmann42 (September 17, 2009 11:36 pm ET)
          2 2
          Camile Paglia can be counted among those who have questions about Obama's legitimacy:
          "First of all, I reject the idea that the "birther" campaign is motivated by racism. There may be racism among it, but there are legitimate questions about the documentation of Obama's birth certificate. I'm sorry, I've been following this closely from the start. To assume that all those signs about the birth controversy were motivated by racism, that is simply wrong. "
          Report Abuse
      • Author by Limit Corp. Ownership (September 17, 2009 5:05 pm ET)
        20 3
        Uh, Point of View, we're talking here about Glenn Beck, you know Glenn Beck, right?...

        You know, the one who has referred of the President many times as Hitler, nazi, fascist, etc..

        Your little tirade is as phony as the Time Magazine article.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 5:07 pm ET)
          3 14
          And you are missing the point and failed to read what MMFA said. They make the implication that all conservatives feel that way about the whole birther and nazi issue. That is garbage, and MMFA knows it, as i suspect you do as well. But why should facts throw you or MMFA of message?
          Report Abuse
          • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 5:14 pm ET)
            11 1
            You've missed the boat, you know dang on well they didn't say all but it does reflect on your party when the leadership doesn't say anything against the backward elements in your party, infact your party embraces it. But i'am glad that now you will speak out against those in your party who spout such nonsense. Glad to see you come around!
            Report Abuse
            • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 5:16 pm ET)
              2 14
              Of course I dont think that way about him, nor do the majority of conservatives. Only wish you and your party would have said the same when Bush was compared to Hitler and attacked on a daily basis!!
              Report Abuse
              • Author by mikeybee (September 17, 2009 5:29 pm ET)
                1  
                hey there Pointofview...

                while I hope it is true that the "majority" of conservatives do not feel that way, I must admit to not seeing alot of evidence to back up your claim. I will admit, I am going by what I see in various media (TV, radio, newsprint, etc.) but it would seem a large number of people do express beliefs along those lines, more importantly, the leaders of the "conservative movement" do as well. however, since you disagree with me about that, who would you consider to be "the voice of conservatism"? who speaks to so called conservative values and yet avoids making attacks of that nature? one who has a national platform from which to spread their message?
                Report Abuse
              • Author by mdh (September 17, 2009 5:53 pm ET)
                   
                The equavalence was greater then. Sorry.
                Report Abuse
              • Author by NewBee (September 17, 2009 8:08 pm ET)
                12 1
                Bush was compared to Hitler and attacked on a daily basis!!
                Bush was too dumb to be Hitler. However, his policies did resemble a creeping form of fascism. No honest, rational, intelligent being could make the argument that Obama's policies resemble Hitler's in the slightest.
                Report Abuse
                • Author by grunt (September 18, 2009 9:23 am ET)
                     
                  Really? The automotive industry takeover? The banking takeover? The sweeping environmental policies? Maybe you should research how Hitler got started. People act as though the only thinkg Hitler did was the Holocaust when conservatives say it, but when liberals say it they are "talking about policy."
                  Report Abuse
              • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 8:13 pm ET)
                10  
                I was speaking of MMFA if the majority of conservastives don't feel that way about Obama where is the criticism of those in your party that do? Your a hyprocrite and if you can seriously accept the lies that Bush told and the war he started that bankrupted this country,you represent the fringe. That is the 28% that supported him at the end of his presidency. You can't be more fringe than less than 1/3 of the population. Enjoy your tea!
                Report Abuse
              • Author by mdey (September 18, 2009 2:26 am ET)
                   
                The majority of protesters that compared President Bush to Hitler were Europeans, and that was only after the invasion of Iraq, two years into his presidency. You can argue that the Iraq invasion was kind of Hitleresque. But what has President Obama done that is in any way similar to Hitler or the Nazis?
                Report Abuse
              • Author by political_left-religious_right (September 18, 2009 6:47 pm ET)
                5  
                Of course I dont [sic] think that way about him, nor do the majority of conservatives. Only wish you and your party would have said the same when Bush was compared to Hitler and attacked on a daily basis!!

                So, pointless, you're accusing MMFA of using a broad brush in attacking conservatives, but you're doing precisely the same thing when you say our party attacked Bush. You didn't say everyone in our party, and MMFA didn't say all conservatives. Same thing.

                Congrats, you get to wear the scarlet letter--a great big "H".
                Report Abuse
          • Author by creeksneakers2 (September 17, 2009 10:16 pm ET)
            11 1
            They are all nuts. They believe the following crazy things, among thousands of other crazy things:

            1. ACORN caused a global finacial meltdown

            2. George Soros controls the world.

            3. Democrats complete rely on a radical dead for decades for all their political strategy.

            4. Democrats want the population to be in miserable poverty so they can be controlled and enslaved.

            5. Death panels

            6. Gay marriage will end the institution of marriage.

            7. The news media is in on it.

            8. If we don't spend $600 billion a year on the military we'll be taken over by some unnamed enemy.

            9. Obama is secretly a communist and was raised by communists to be a communist.

            Nearly all Republicans believe this insanity.


            Report Abuse
            • Author by grunt (September 18, 2009 9:34 am ET)
                 
              1. Groups like ACORN CONTRIBUTED to the housing crisis by helping unqualified buyers get into homes they couldn't afford. This was assisted by the CRA.

              2. George Soros controls parts of the left-wing media and you are all his pawns.

              3. Both sides use Alinsky tactics. Liberal progressives perfected the technique.

              4. Some liberals not democrats. In fact, many liberals do want to enslave people as evidenced by the big arm of government they support. More government rarely equals more freedom and usually leads to enslavery.

              5. What does rationing equal??

              6. The government should have no role in marriage in the first place. Straight or gay. Civil unions for all.

              7. NBC is in on it. GE stands to make billions of dollars if the left's policies are passed. Major conflict of interest.

              8. The common defense is one of the few things required in the Constitution for the government to sustain. A strong DEFENSIVE military is key to our survival. An aggresive military is not.

              9. Obama has a shady past compared to most former presidents. I don't know if it is communist, but there are some shady characters back there.

              Just one conservatives opinion in each of the points you outlined. Are my rebuttals crazy compared to what was and is said about President Bush?
              Report Abuse
          • Author by DellDolly (September 17, 2009 10:35 pm ET)
            7 1
            No, MMFA does not make the implication that all conservatives feel 'that way' about the whole birther and nazi issues. We're not to blame for the fact that your reading comprehension skills are so lacking that you can't figure out the context of what was written.

            Saying "Conservatives believe...." doesn't mean that all Conservatives believe that.

            It means 'Conservatives' versus 'Liberals' or 'Independents'. It doesn't mean "all" Conservatives.

            Jamison is talking about the false equivalency argument that Time Magazine tried to make, and he was making the point that it was "Conservatives" who had been doing outrageous things, not Liberals. But he never wrote, nor ever meant, that all Conservatives believe that.

            And don't you dare blame this on Jamison. The context is clear - you simply had a knee-jerk reaction to a sentence taken out of context.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by pete592 (September 18, 2009 4:23 pm ET)
            5  
            "They make the implication that all conservatives feel that way about the whole birther and nazi issue. That is garbage, and MMFA knows it"

            I'll keep this in mind the next time I see a generalization lobbed at liberals, namely from you.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by dratman (September 18, 2009 7:15 pm ET)
            4  
            Hi, pointofview. I'm glad to know that not all conservatives "feel that way about the whole birther and nazi issue."

            Since you so oppose having that mindset attributed to all conservatives, you have a chance to contribute a one-person example of how untrue the myth of conservative radicalism really is.

            Do you personally believe that Barack Obama was born in Kenya?

            Do you maintain that he is comparable to a Nazi?

            Do you think he is going to institute death camps?

            More generally, is Barack Obama the legitimate President of the United States?

            One person at a time, you and your friends can help tear down the prejudiced idea of conservative fanaticism which you so much dislike. This moment, here and now, you can begin to displace that radical image of the conservative movement. You can denouncing the pointless sloganeering. You can help turn back the tide of public opinion, simply by behaving differently from the stereotypes.
            Report Abuse
      • Author by miriamsong (September 17, 2009 5:05 pm ET)
        14 2
        The entire Republican Party either projects these lies or refuses to condemn them. Your party's top brass is addicted to Limbaugh, Beck, and their hateful, ignorant spewings. They know that they owe their positions to the most reactionary, vicious elements on the scene today. It's too late for your fainting spell of conscience-stricken regret -- you've tied your fate to them, and the train is speeding towards Hell; enjoy the ride.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 5:08 pm ET)
            12
          lol..thanks....needed that laugh
          Report Abuse
          • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 5:17 pm ET)
            10  
            Limbaugh: "we are fighting a fascist, social-- whatever you call it take over and remaking of the United States of America"
            Want me to keep digging!
            Report Abuse
        • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 5:28 pm ET)
          3 14
          The entire Republican Party either projects these lies or refuses to condemn them


          That is of course ridiculous.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by overmars jr. (September 17, 2009 6:28 pm ET)
            8  
            Yes, it is ridiculous for them to behave that way. You are right, for once.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by NewBee (September 17, 2009 8:10 pm ET)
            7  
            That is of course ridiculous.
            Name some conservative that neither "projects these lies" or "refuses to condemn them". I can't think of a one. Help us out.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 8:25 pm ET)
            5  
            It is well show us the criticism.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by DellDolly (September 17, 2009 10:43 pm ET)
            8  
            It's not ridiculous to assert that the Republican Party has done a crappy job of policing their own.

            Heck, they had a Congressman violate the civil rules of the House last week, and were so upset about it that they made him immediately call Rahm Emmanuel and arrange to apologize to the President, but then when the next apology should have happened, to the whole House, they buckled.

            They refuse to acknowledge the fringe elements of their party are not simply 1%'ers. They pretend it's not a big deal that some people still don't accept the incontrovertible fact that Obama was born in Hawaii, and therefore is a natural born citizen, and since he didn't renounce his US Citizenship and become a Kenyan citizen when he was a young adult, he's still a US Citizen and eligible to be President. Someone in a seat of power in the Republican Party should explain that to their followers. They won't.

            All kinds of lies keep getting told about Health Care Reform, and the leadership still refuses to rein in those liars. In many cases, it's the leadership who's lying! (Can you say John Boehner?) And yeah, it's lies. It's not just opposition stances. We don't get on them because they disagree with the liberal stance. We see that they refuse to condemn the lies.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by drphonic (September 18, 2009 1:40 pm ET)
              4  
              Republicans don't police their own because they want these insinusations, these implications, these outright lies to stick. And judging from some of the absolutely pathological responses here, they have succeeded. Republicans are republicans because they are SCUM. Period.
              Report Abuse
        • Author by Lee2009 (September 18, 2009 1:18 pm ET)
             
          Specifically, what are the lies? Or is it you who is lying?
          Report Abuse
      • Author by Jurgan (September 17, 2009 5:17 pm ET)
        12  
        "To make the implication that all conservatives, or even most feel this way"

        Wow, it's a good thing he didn't say that.

        Some conservatives have said those things. It's undeniable. The problem isn't that the majority of conservatives believe hateful, racist things- I'm fairly certain they don't. The problem is that the leaders of the conservative movement refuse to denounce them, and the media accentuates their importance. It's the mainstream media, not MMfA, who allow the fringe to dominate the debate. Honestly, if I were an honest, sensible conservative, I'd be mad at the way the media treats the conservative movement, because they're the ones who give disproportionate strength to a small minority. They obsess over rowdy town hall protesters and birther nuts. They act as though Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck speak for all conservatives. You claim to be a reasonable conservative- great. Why aren't you mad as hell that these vicious lying b*stards are being treated as the head of the Republican party?

        I will agree with you on the overuse of Hitler analogies, though- that is a problem on both sides (even if I think there's more truth to the left's accusations).
        Report Abuse
        • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 5:27 pm ET)
          2 13
          Why aren't you mad as hell that these vicious lying b*stards are being treated as the head of the Republican party?


          Why am I not mad? That is the job of the media. They want ratings, they want to sell papers and magazines. The same can be said about the Dem leaders who were not outraged when Moveon.org attacked an American General. Why didnt the Dem leaders fight to get in front of the cameras to denounce that? It cuts both ways. The fringe groups on both sides always get the attention.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 5:33 pm ET)
            10  
            You have a habit of repeating talking points and providing no facts. MOVE.ON is a private citizen group it was private citizens speaking and they were not attacking Patreus. But regardless some Dems did stand in a vote for criticize the ad. I have yet to see one Sen. come out and critizie or call for a congressional admonishment for what Glenn Beck says or those who are bringing weap[ons to town hall events. Not one! Your flase equivalency falls flat again!
            Report Abuse
            • Author by worrierking (September 17, 2009 5:52 pm ET)
              10  
              And plenty of people let moveon.org know that they weren't happy with their ad attacking the general. Pointy knows this. He also knows that many Democratic Reps and Senators voted for the resolution condemning Moveon.

              Pointy is a vile, blind, partisan hack. Great at false equivalency and attacks against anyone who does not conform to his narrow views.
              Report Abuse
              • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 7:27 pm ET)
                6  
                I agree King , the thing is he protest your characterization , then goes on to prove it with his rants.
                Report Abuse
            • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 6:14 pm ET)
                11
              And Beck is a private citizen. So again, what is your point!!
              Report Abuse
              • Author by NewBee (September 17, 2009 8:12 pm ET)
                8  
                And Beck is a private citizen. So again, what is your point!!
                Where's the condemnation of Beck, the way there was bipartisan rebuke of MoveOn?
                Report Abuse
              • Author by PSzymeczek (September 18, 2009 2:50 pm ET)
                5  
                And Beck is a private citizen. So again, what is your point!!


                He is spewing his garbage on the public airwaves, so that makes him fair game for criticism.
                Report Abuse
          • Author by foghornleghorn (September 17, 2009 9:32 pm ET)
            6  
            when Moveon.org attacked an American General

            Last time I checked, moveon.org wasn't a media organization.

            False analogy. Try again.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by Easy to refute wingnuts (September 20, 2009 4:05 pm ET)
              2  
              PointedHead also doesn't mention what the purpose of MoveOn was when it was founded, because it pops his "it is a liberal outfit" bubble.

              Maybe pointy can look it up and let a little light into his shuttered world.
              Report Abuse
          • Author by SMTDL (September 18, 2009 12:38 pm ET)
            3  
            That's just not true..almost all Dems came out against Move on for the Petraeus/Betrayus ad!!!But that was one ad and the end of that type of below the belt attack!!Fox News,Cons talk Radio,tea baggers and birthers have been telling lies about Candidate Obama and now President Obama non stop for a year.He's been called racist,nazi ,commie,marxist ,socialist,fascist,tyrant,wuss,terroist,kenyan,muslim,arab,liar,magic Negro,uppity,monkey,dead chimp,boy,black man-child,brownman,stagehand,apologist in chief,community organizer in chief etc .etc.....The 1st lady has been called uppity,racist,angry,told that she has gorilla ancestors,etc..who next Malia and Sasha???.
            There is no equivalency on the left for the sheer volume and vitriol that comes from the right.The use of terms like revolution,battle,insurrection,and other references to violence is coming only from the right.The people bringing guns and signs implying violence are from the right.The effigy hangings of elected Dems and even the DEM donkey -all from the right-Racial emails and defacing of a Dem office in Ga.Really a lot more could be covered..already well documented.Why can't the leader of the Republican party tone this back before there is more violence..Go ask Mr. Limbaugh nicely to do so Please....because Steele,Boehner/Cantor/Gingrich nor any other prominent Republican Leader has done so.Only Colin Powel has done so and not apologized immediately!!.
            Report Abuse
        • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 5:27 pm ET)
          10  
          It is no way equal. No one showed up to G.Bush events armed. In fact if you wore a tea shirt critical of Bush at a Bush event you were kicked out. Bushs public events were shams. This is in no way the same. Those that did call him Hitler had a very good reason to. Torture,lying us into War,signing statments,warrantless wiretapping,false imprisonment without charges or right to habeuas corpus,...the whine from the right is bogus and not comparable.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 5:32 pm ET)
            1 11
            It is in every way equal. Lets look at the facts here.

            1. A man came to a rally with a legal permit to carry a gun, was no where near the President, and did not harm anyone. Get over it.

            2. If Bush did all of these horrible things, then why has Obama:

            a. not closed Gitmo
            b. extended the patriot act
            c. not pulled us from Iraq
            d. made no serious attempt to repeal virtually any of the Bush war policies

            I love your logic. The Left has good reason to compare Bush to a man who murdered millions....so its ok for them to do it. Grow Up!!
            Report Abuse
            • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 5:46 pm ET)
              9  
              It just shows the fallacy of your sides rants. If Obama is doing everything Bush did why are you so angry. The fact is he not. Not pulled out of Iraq? Really did he promise to gwet us out in 9 months. GITMO will be closed but it's only been 9 months but rest assured it will be closed. The PATRIOT ACT was extended by Congress your being silly now. He has banned torture! I love the way you try and find false equivalencies but fail. You can't have it both ways! There were more than one instance where people showed up to townhall meetings armed. No harm was done those times but there have been people killed in DC, and Dr, Tiller and in Pittsburgh(3 cops) so don't tell me to get over it. The fact is no -one not one person came tio Bushs meetings armed. People were kicked out his meeting for the dangerous thing of wearing a tea-shirt. That you could compare the two and accept the gun totting just proves my point just much on the fringe you and your party are. Keep talking your putting your putting your foot deeper down your throat or is it your head further up your butt.
              Report Abuse
              • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 6:19 pm ET)
                1 12
                An anti abortion protester was shot and killed this week. You try and try again, yet you fail. How do the deaths in DC, or Tiller, relate to a man who has a permit to carry a weapon, and was LEGALLY and PEACEFULLY doing so. Thats right...it does not!!
                Report Abuse
                • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 6:58 pm ET)
                  7  
                  He was an anti-abortion protestor and your being dishonest if your saying that was the sole reason or the reason he was shot. I brought up the other examples because they represented the fringe of the hate Obama crowd that is now being played to by your party. Contrary to resorting to reason argument your side has attached itself to the crazies,calling Obama a racistwho hates white culture and white people,who show up to events with posters of him in white face and red lips, others comparing him to monkeys in the zoo, this has become the face of your party, and as yet no-one has called for a congressional rebuttal from your party against these people,and YOU still refuse to call for civility and reason by condoning people bringing weapons which again shows just how much out of touch YOU and YOUR party are, and who you have become. You want to debate issues then stop embracing the crazies who disrupt debate. You don't want to be considered crackpot and tired of being labeld racist and crazy then stop embracing those in your party that are.
                  Report Abuse
                • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 7:11 pm ET)
                  5  
                  and so what if it's legal, why do it? What were these protestors trying to say? Why were t-shirt protestors kept away from Bush gatherings but YOU find this ok. There is no reasoned argument you can make to justify threatening the President. That you find it acceptable just reeks of hyprocrisy. You call MMFA absurd for its characterization of your party then go on to prove their point by embracing the birthers,the creatures from the second amendment,and any other fringe movement that comes along. You lie down with dogs and you get fleas. Get over it crackpot!
                  Report Abuse
                  • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 7:32 pm ET)
                    1 10
                    I reallyyyy want some of what you are smoking. It must be good stuff.

                    I have never once...never defended the birthers.

                    I do defend the second amendment, as you should defend it as well.

                    Your third point in which you claim I defend "any other fringe movement that comes along" was your best. Of course you have nothing to support that but your own rantings and what ever you are smoking....which again, I wish you would share.

                    I have said many times that those who used racial attacks against the President are wrong. You of course, simply choose to ignore that, and want to paint all conservatives with a broad racist brush. No matter how many times you say it, it is still not true.
                    Report Abuse
                    • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 7:40 pm ET)
                      7  
                      No not everyone just you!
                      Report Abuse
                      • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 7:59 pm ET)
                        1 9
                        spoken like a true racist!!
                        Report Abuse
                      • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 8:18 pm ET)
                        7  
                        Yea I've seen many times POV where you've spoken out about Glenn Beck! NOT! Not in this post and never on this site. Racist..huh! I'll just consider the gutter it came from and overlook it.
                        Report Abuse
                        • Author by goesto11 (September 18, 2009 8:51 am ET)
                          3  
                          Congero,

                          Technically speaking, Obama didn't "ban" torture. It has been a crime for the US to torture people for many, many years.

                          It was a crime when the Bush administration utilized it.

                          Obama simply reminded our intelligence and military personnel that it is indeed still a crime, despite what Bush/Cheney may have ordered people to do.
                          Report Abuse
      • Author by mdh (September 17, 2009 5:51 pm ET)
        1  
        So your point is that conservatives in the media are not representative of conservative views? Bravo Sherlock.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by micky6966 (September 17, 2009 7:49 pm ET)
           
        So, why is it that I got an urgent call from a friend who was watching FAUX NOISE? The story said flat out that Obama wanted to euthanize anyone over the age of 74. Why is it that Genn Beck can say, "I don't think Obama's a racist, I just think he has a problem with white people"? It's sick and sad. I just hope every single person who said Down With Socialism turns down their Social Security check and their Medicare.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by NewBee (September 17, 2009 8:04 pm ET)
        7  
        A very few conservatives have compared Obama to Hitler
        Very few? Really? There are several posters on here alone who still try to conflate Obama with Nazism. Unless the cons that lurk around here are not representative, you are seriously delusional or seriously dishonest. In your case, I'm pretty sure it's the latter.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by sodium (September 17, 2009 8:40 pm ET)
        7  
        pointofview took a swig of moonshine and screeched: " 'Conservatives have been yelling about President Obama being a secret Kenyan bent on sending granny to the Death Panel, comparing him to Hitler and Mao and Stalin and who-knows-who-else -'

        This is a flat out lie, and dishonest in every redard(sic)."

        Huh?

        You're seriously claiming no posters of a witch doctor Obama have been used? That the "birthers" don't exist? And that no Nazi accusations have been flying?

        Please tell me, what planet do you like to spend most of your time on?


        Report Abuse
      • Author by funnymanpants (September 17, 2009 9:21 pm ET)
        7  
        >>This is a flat out lie, and dishonest in every redard.

        If it's a flat-out lie, then you should be able to show how, right? I mean, very easily. You state "MMFA will never accept that you can oppose the policies Obama stands for, and not be a racist or think Obama is Hitler." Or really? And you know that how?

        The rest of your post is hard to address, because it is simply a rant--a series of provocative statements that can't be proven or disproven.

        You failed to really challenge the content of the MMFA piece. *Time* completely white-washed the lies of Beck.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by greymatter (September 17, 2009 9:26 pm ET)
        1  
        A poll done back in May via conservativehq.com revealed that 91% of self identified conservatives think Obama is socialist/Marxist/facist/communist.

        More recently, a Research 2000 poll done back in August showed that for self-identified Republicans, only 32% disbelieved that the health care bill was "trying to kill grandma". That's less than 1/3.

        So your claim of "To make the implication that all conservatives, or even most feel this way is what will always keep MMFA a fringe far left outfit reporting on those in the fringe far right." is clearly off base and completely untrue, when polls show that MOST conservatives/Republicans DO in fact think these things.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by DellDolly (September 17, 2009 10:31 pm ET)
        4  
        When Jamison Foser is saying "Conservatives believe...." he doesn't mean that all Conservatives believe that.

        It means 'Conservatives' versus 'Liberals' or 'Independents'. It doesn't mean "all" Conservatives.

        Jamison is talking about the false equivalency argument that Time Magazine tried to make, and he was making the point that it was "Conservatives" who had been doing outrageous things, not Liberals.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by Boxer1979 (September 17, 2009 10:55 pm ET)
        3  
        Where you been POV? Mars?
        Report Abuse
      • Author by ignoreland (September 18, 2009 11:38 am ET)
           
        Wow - the sentence says, "Conservatives have been yelling...", not "All conservatives have been yelling...". And when a prominent Senator makes the claim that Obama is going to kill Granny, that gets national news play. And that email with a toothbrush-mustached Obama made the rounds of conservative inboxes. So, the facts on the ground support Jameson's and not your "point of view". That truthiness thing deflates rather easily.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by slappymagoo (September 18, 2009 2:44 pm ET)
        2  
        How is it a lie exactly. MMFA isn't saying ALL conservatives are saying these things about Obama. But conservatives certainly are saying these things.

        Worse, hardly any conservatives are trying to set that record straight. Only recently are a few conservative writers saying "enough" to the LCD pandering. Indeed, Beck is in an IDEAL situation to separate fact from fiction, point out what he doesn't like about Obama but still being honest about it. Of course, his viewers don't want that. And quite frankly, neither does he.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by rasotis (September 18, 2009 5:22 pm ET)
        2  
        Excuse me but you obviously don't know what you are talking about. Pictures of Obama with Hitler's mustache have been de rigueur at tea party rallies and town hall meetings all Summer.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by yancy derringer (September 18, 2009 5:31 pm ET)
        2  
        A very few conservatives have compared Obama to Hitler,


        Actually you have it backasswards. When a few war protesters compared Bush to Hitler the right acted like it was everyone.

        Seriously pov, what planet do you live on? Not only do we have eyes and can see the numerous signs at the protests, we hear them being interviewed. If they didn't have an "Obama is Hitler" sign they were cheering on those who did. Are you saying that the teabaggers are not conservatives? Are you trying, as the Republican party, to act like you are not the same as people like Bachmann now. I guess it is time to put on a new skin and work toward conning people in 2010.

        The leaders of the conservative movement regularly compare Obama to Hitler. You may be confused because Beck will say he “isn't comparing Obama to Hitler" right before he compares Obama to Hitler.

        Rush does it all the time and Rush conditions about 20 million minds.

        POV, you have to use what is called critical thinking. You will learn about that in the tenth grade, just wait, you'll see.

        First comment? What, do you just sit and wait for a new post to come up so you can sidetrack it with absurd horseturds?
        Report Abuse
      • Author by thenumber17 (September 18, 2009 8:20 pm ET)
           
        Fine, pointofview, oppose Obama's policies. I have no issue with that. I oppose some of them myself (Hello, preventative detention, anyone?). But be honest in your opposition. Don't talk about Death Panels and Birth Certificates. It may be true that you never bought into that stuff, but it is clear that the Republican leadership at least wants to use it to rile up the base, which is cynicism of the worst kind.

        It would also be nice if those in opposition could give the specific things to which they are opposed. Saying "I want my country back" or "Socialism, Fascism" is not an argument. Getting angry over "czars" just makes you look silly when you look an inch below the surface and see that a) many of these "czars" are Senate approved, and b) Reagan started the whole "czars" thing and Bush 1, Clinton, and Bush 2 all used them.

        Another thing, please provide solutions to the problems we are facing that go beyond "tax cuts" or "free market." I think the free market is a great way to do business, but until conservatives get honest about the fact that it can't do everything, this country is going to be treading water, at best.

        I'd also ask for a little consistency, being that I heard nary a peep about spending during the Bush years.

        As for the Bush/Obama comparisons, first I'll say I agree with you that Hitler is thrown around with way too much ease by both sides. As for the criticisms of Bush vs the criticisms of Obama, here's the difference. People were angry with Bush for things that he had actually done, not for things they thought he might do, but had absolutely no evidence for.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by dandelion (September 18, 2009 9:02 pm ET)
        2  
        A very few conservatives have compared Obama to Hitler, and a very few think he is trying to kill grandma.

        I think the right can combat these perceptions by standing up to the extremists within their ranks. Instead they've been an amen choir to the crackpots. Think about it -- the absurd examples you cite didn't come from Media Matters. They came from high-profile conservatives such as Rush Limbaugh and Sarah Palin. Until mainstream conservatives denounce such inflammatory rhetoric we have to conclude that they agree with it.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by The Noetic1 (September 17, 2009 5:10 pm ET)
      1  
      Simplest thing to do is just turn OFF the TV and radio and avoid the corporate media desire to steer your brain to more the irresponsible, disconnected, hope for failure psycho babble unleashed on the cable or radio airwaves.

      If you really want to keep your finger on the new pulse of insanity by watching them, then DON'T buy anything from those that advertise on the dysfunctional talking heads and let them know.
      For the time being, it is obvious we've lost real "news" reporting and time will be better spent with family, friends and if you can, vetting the bad news claims over the internet.

      These players don't give a tinker's damn about you, community, state nor the well being of this country or its future.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by beautykilledbeast1515 (September 17, 2009 6:07 pm ET)
         
      There is one thing missing here and I fail to understand why, sort of: competition.

      Glenn Beck works for The News Corporation (two heapings of irony there brother). Time Magazine is published by Time Warner, arguably the largest communications company in the Universe. Yes, I said, the Universe. In nearly every type of media, these organizations go head-to-head, hand-to-hand and toe-to-toe, yet they behave as if keeping Americans frothy and fearful is a grand strategic partnership.

      Simply, why does Time Warner not bury Glenn Beck but praise him?
      Report Abuse
    • Author by latichever (September 17, 2009 6:11 pm ET)
      5  
      You don't need to go to the Midwest to find a suitable comparison for the 9-12 crowd. Fedex field where the Redskins play in Landover MD has seating for 91,000, which is regularly filled to capacity even though, I have to say, the team stinks.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by latichever (September 17, 2009 6:11 pm ET)
      3  
      You don't need to go to the Midwest to find a suitable comparison for the 9-12 crowd. Fedex field where the Redskins play in Landover MD has seating for 91,000, which is regularly filled to capacity even though, I have to say, the team stinks.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by Major Tom (September 17, 2009 6:40 pm ET)
      5  
      Brilliant indictment of the media... I agree. It was a Performance piece at best. At worst, Time has aided and abetted the ridiculously undeniable, and equally disturbing trend towards completely editorializing the media. The subjective regins in the 21st century. Today, attempts at objectivity may as well be seen as attempts at chivalry. I hope Journalism is still on life support somewhere.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by only_myschly3567 (September 17, 2009 7:15 pm ET)
      3  
      Wow... Just wow... Can't MMFA start a petition against this "journalist", calling on Time to fire Drehle?

      This is outrageous. It is just too much. Start a petition, the President of CNN might stick to Dobbs, but maybe Time is more keen to get rid of its bad weeds?
      Report Abuse
      • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 7:35 pm ET)
        1 9
        I agree. We need to protest and boycott Time magazine. How dare they right an article, a cover story no less, with out the MMFA stamp of approval?? This has to stop!! Imagine, living in a country where a magazine can write a piece about a conservative that is not an attack piece. THIS MUST STOP.

        Please join me, and lets start making a list of all those who advertise in Time magazine.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 7:42 pm ET)
          2 11
          Here is a sample letter. Tell me what you think.

          Dear Time Magazine:

          It has come to our attention that you have written a story about Glen Beck. Furthermore, it has come to our attention that you did not provide MMFA with an advance copy of the story, nor did you seek their input in the writing process. This is simply unacceptable!!

          No where in this article did you refer to Beck as evil, Satan, the Anit-Christ, a liar, bigot, racist, or other MMFA approves labels. As a result, we must, as patriotic left leaning Americans, begin a boycott of your magazine, and we must start a campaign to force all of your advertisers to abandon your publication. In addition, we will run a list of advertisers who still choose to support you.

          This boycott will stop once you allow MMFA to preview as well as edit all future articles you run on people who are conservatives, know conservatives, or are related to conservatives.

          We eagerly await your response.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by NewBee (September 17, 2009 8:18 pm ET)
            8  
            I have a simpler one: Start being real journalists and leave the puff pieces to People magazine.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by steeve (September 18, 2009 12:19 pm ET)
            3  
            This is why conservatives and the media will never get it right.

            In order to be balanced, not liberal but balanced, the Time article must state that Beck is a habitual liar and state nothing else. Beck's lies are the totality of his television persona, and to focus on anything else is to deny the truth and to highlight the insignificant.

            In a media bias study, an article stating forcefully that Beck is a habitual liar would be classified as liberal. But such an article would be playing it right down the middle.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by tgarcia6327 (September 18, 2009 1:37 pm ET)
               
            Sounds good to me. Send it!
            Report Abuse
        • Author by NewBee (September 17, 2009 8:17 pm ET)
          7  
          How dare they right[sic] an article, a cover story no less, with out the MMFA stamp of approval??
          They should 'right' this article. As it is, it certainly is wrong.
          Report Abuse
    • Author by fabucat58 (September 17, 2009 7:47 pm ET)
      4  
      It's time for a Color Of Change boycott against Time Magazine. This cover story is a slap against all African-Americans and women. Hell, it's a slap against all decent sensible people.

      When did TIME feature Olbermann, Mike Moore, or Ed Schultz on its cover? Oh yeah, NEVER!
      Report Abuse
      • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 7:50 pm ET)
        2 9
        Yesssssssss. Power to the People!!
        Report Abuse
      • Author by pointofview (September 17, 2009 8:17 pm ET)
        2 9
        Mike Moore was on Leno...and the ratings plunged!!
        Report Abuse
        • Author by NewBee (September 17, 2009 8:19 pm ET)
          6  
          Mike Moore was on Leno...and the ratings plunged!
          Unfortunately, Mike hadn't interrupted Taylor Swift the night before, otherwise more people would have tuned in.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by congero6189599 (September 17, 2009 8:34 pm ET)
            5  
            I can't wait to see his new movie. I'am sure it will be a hit and every bit as informative as "SICKO" and "F/9-11."
            Report Abuse
      • Author by proudconservative (September 18, 2009 6:10 pm ET)
          2
        fabukitty,

        Why not? Because they need to sell to a potential audience of at least 2 dozen interested readers. oberman, moore and schultz are just not that important, although I like obermann on ESPN.

        Speaking truth to/about progressives.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by toetappinheadbobbin7468 (September 17, 2009 8:02 pm ET)
      1  
      Time Magazine's decision to place Glenn Beck on the cover prompted up to discontinue our subscription.
      Why this magazine with their former reputation would elect to glorify this individual who has placed on the air lie after lie regarding what is in the health care reform proposals- some one who has invested countless hours to retain the divisiveness we now see, who uses dangerously inflammatory rhetoric and name-calling with abandon, a man who mused about poisoning the speaker of the house, and other off-the-rails activity -would be more likely seen not on the cover of TIME but rather on the corner of Times Square- dressed in sandwich boards.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by JohnPaul (September 17, 2009 9:44 pm ET)
         
      cancel your time magazine subscriptions.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by Peter Principle (September 17, 2009 9:45 pm ET)
      4  
      When the Beck/Limbaugh right finally gets it's wish, and they round us all up and take us to the camps, all I ask is that the shoot David Von Drehle first, so that I can watch.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by papa bear3 (September 19, 2009 5:34 pm ET)
        1  
        Careful, David Von Drehle might be writing the story for FOX's newest acquisition, Time.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by night-n-day (September 17, 2009 11:08 pm ET)
      2  
      GLENN BECK ON A DATE:

      BECK: What??!! What are you talking about?! It's HUGE! I know you've never seen one this big before!!
      Report Abuse
    • Author by mitchellvii (September 17, 2009 11:50 pm ET)
         
      Good lord, you people on the left with that 70,000 figure. Ok, let me set you straight.

      The 70,000 figure was not given as an "official estimate" by the DC Fire Department as it is NOT their policy to estimate crowd size since it can be a political football. This estimate was NOT based on any actual counting or scientific method, it was just made by a Fire Department Official hazarding a guess. As a matter of fact, this offcial went out of his way to say that his guess was in no way an official statement.

      Now there are about 20 other estimates that measure the crowd at 500,000 to 1.2 million, but we'll ignore those since it doesn't follow our liberal meme. We'll go with the lowball unofficial guess. Oh yeah. And we'll call everyone else liars.

      We'll also say that any estimate by a conservative is a LIE since it was made by a conservative, yet we will take liberals word for it on how many people atended Obama's Coronation.

      All you need to do is watch the opening 3 hours parade of nonstop humanity to realize this crowd was massive. 70,000 is a pathetic joke.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by mitchellvii (September 17, 2009 11:55 pm ET)
         
      Liberals, here is your chance. Please list for me 55 LIES that Glenn beck has told on his show. NOT matters of opinion with which you disagree, but actual lies which can be proven to be false.

      How about the LIES he told about Van Jones. Oh that's right, he just showed video of Jones talking in his own words. If beck was telling LIES about Jones, why did Obama through his good friend under the bus without even a single counter-punch?

      Because Glenn beck told and does tell the truth and you can't handle the truth.

      P.S., You guys are aware that you are going to get pwned at the ballot box in 2010, right? You counting on the blacks and youth to turn out en masse in a mid term election? I predict you lose 70 seats in the house alone and harry Reid in the Senate will be gone.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by daphnechyprious (September 18, 2009 2:43 am ET)
         
      Calling him "funny" may be the biggest lie of all. It appears Time didn't lose enough subscribers after the Coulter love fest, so now they've decided to finish the effort.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by Bungy (September 18, 2009 3:35 am ET)
         
      Sooo. Jamison Foser writes this criticism for MMFA of a Time Magazine article about Glenn Beck. The general thesis is that the myth of balance leads Time to treat the facticity of liberal and conservative claims as relative and equal. Using several examples, but mostly stressing the amazing gaffe of the crowd estimates of 9-12, Foser shows how wildly inaccurate Time is in its assessments.

      Then Pointofview, in typical tu quoque rhetoric of the current Right, says of Foser, "You LIE!" How so? Because in Pointy's mind, Foser implies that all Conservatives have bought into birther and death panel propaganda. The article says nothing of the sort, of course. The sentence, in both context and construction, simply notes the ideological bent of those making those charges.

      The good news: folks like Pointy, even though defensive of conservatives, don't actually believe the birther or death panel claims. Whew! The bad news: he/she doesn't care about truth. Cynicism reigns. Everybody lies. No media is to be trusted. And Glen Beck and his ilk can be guano crazy and factually wrong, but still "morally" right. Because its the movement -- and the resistance to all things Obama -- that really matters. The ends justifies the means, right?

      My frustration with Time's story on Beck has nothing to do with the affront of covering Beck or even writing positively about him. Something bad happens to Time's credibility when, in the service to that profile, it distorts the facts. One thing to provide Beck's interpretation of the facts, his justification for his claims. Quite another to make those clearly and demonstrably false Beck claims on a par with verifiable facts that disprove them -- from crowd numbers to the crazy things Beck says.

      But in the end, it is the conservative troll with the reprise of Rep. Wilson's martyred act of speaking falsehood to power that becomes the focus of the comments for this article. One person. One comment, with follow up "rebuttals." The same tired, cynical memes. A microcosm, that, for 9-12, birthers, Beck followers, etc. Is our attention to him that much different than the media's attention to those fringe movements?

      But seriously, dude, all conservatives aren't like that. Sha!
      Report Abuse
    • Author by luiscastaneda (September 18, 2009 8:49 am ET)
         
      Respect means nothing anymore
      Report Abuse
    • Author by roninkannushi1711 (September 18, 2009 9:12 am ET)
      2  
      Fellow Matterers,

      Mr.Foser wrote a level-handed, and at times, funny article. The part where he writes about crowd estimates: "...it came from ,'sane,' sources,..." got me laughing, big-time! Why not trust the professionals? They have done the job before, and have the experience. Conservative gossip estimates could not be supported by the evidence; buses, hotel vacancies, and a clogged metro system. Surely, reports would have abounded. Let alone the economic boost, to the city.

      Kudos, on this article!

      It be it,
      Ronin Kannushi.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by Klaatu (September 18, 2009 12:04 pm ET)
         
      I loove you! I really do. It's whiners like you that inspire people like us to speak up and get involved. Keep up the inspiring work! Truthfully, I feel sorry for you. You really don't have a clue. Oh, by the way...you haven't seen anything yet.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by Hit them in the Wallet (September 18, 2009 12:22 pm ET)
         
      We have got to take a stand for public safety sake.

      Open Call for American Citizens to Take Action Against Fox News Network, Mark Williams and Rush Limbaugh

      On September 17, 2009, Speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi, warned of possible violence if the rhetoric wasn’t toned down across the nation.

      We all seem to know where the rhetoric is coming from. Fox News Network www.foxnews.com, Glenn Beck, Mark Williams www.marktalk.com/blog, Hannity, Limbaugh www.rushlimbaugh.com and O’Reilly have motivated thousands of conservatives to turn out for tea bag, birther and deather events.

      We are asking you, if you believe, Fox News is a major component in inciting our citizens, utilizing, their media outlet as a weapon, to derail peace. Remember, our goal is not to infringe on anybody’s freedom of speech rights. However, the question is, whether the words used by this network, are used in such circumstances, and are of such a nature, as to put, us, all, in clear or present danger.

      That their words, will incite, substantive, evils against our citizens or president.

      Military familes have already taken a stand when they wrote the Department Of Defense regarding supporting Fox News and the adverse effects Fox were having on their community, not only did they pull advertising, they also, blocked Fox News at military installations, as being restricted material.

      http://hiteminthewallet.wordpress.com/2009/09/18/open-call-for-american-citizens-to-take-action-against-fox-news-network-mark-williams-and-rush-limbaugh/

      Report Abuse
    • Author by patriotjjd (September 18, 2009 1:04 pm ET)
         
      What are you people after? Did you pay attention in history class? I get the idea that you didn't. Does anybody know why we teach history in school? I think you don't. Do you not understand the nature of man? Again, I think you don't. If you don't understand some of these things, think about them the next time you see a child out of control and say to yourself, that kids parents are a failure. You may think I am talking out of my ass, but if you stop and think about what I am saying, you will understand. You will be able to understand why our government is set up the way it is and why it needs to stay the way it is. Sorry people, I agree with Beck. Not to say that things are not sensationalized. All news agencies do that to get our attention. Those who left Beck left the show that is number one in it's time slot. Those are the stupid people, not Beck. Just like a liberal, I am going to take my ball and go home. Bye!
      Report Abuse
    • Author by LickDaCat (September 18, 2009 1:11 pm ET)
         
      Wake up people. Beck is the only one exposing the corruption. He is the only one telling the truth.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by LickDaCat (September 18, 2009 1:24 pm ET)
         
      I was at the march in DC on 9/12 and the number of Patriotic Americans far exceeded 70,000 many times over.

      It was not a bunch of racists. There was a collection of people from all races, ages, political parties etc. Also there was not one arrest all day.

      I think we ran the criminals out of town because on an average day there are arrests since DC is one of the most crime ridden cities in America and that would be without congress being in session. With congress in session it would have to rank as the most crime-ridden city on the planet. I would say that the Capitol Building and congressional offices would be considered the most criminal area on the planet by criminals per square foot.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by cad45 (September 18, 2009 4:30 pm ET)
         
      Good thing there is no trace of bias in your article. You, sir, are a stand-up guy.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by proudconservative (September 18, 2009 4:42 pm ET)
        3
      Now eric, just take a sip of some hot coco and relax. Not to worry, 70,000 or 2 million makes no difference. The resurgence of conservatism is in the hearts of many more Americans than that as evidenced in how loudly the left protests. Despite the haranguing, congress is waking up and stepping back from the socialist bent of this administration, slowing down any nonsense about a crisis here or a crisis there. They have heard from voters and again, 70,000 or 2 million is just more of the lefties whistling past the political graveyard.

      PS. Just to make it even, let's hope the next issue of Time has George Soros pictured on it. Instead of sticking out his tongue, he can be shown standing upon all the billions he's made at the expense of the currencies that he speculated against, de-valued and then walked away with, taking millions of individuals' life savings, economic hopes and ability to live securely. Fair enough?
      Report Abuse
      • Author by NewBee (September 18, 2009 5:55 pm ET)
        1  
        Not to worry, 70,000 or 2 million makes no difference.
        Keep telling yourself that.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by proudconservative (September 18, 2009 6:04 pm ET)
            2
          I do keep telling myself that because my lefty comrades are hurting so badly. But when you speak truth to progressives...

          [http://www.affordablehousinginstitute.org/blogs/us/Whistling_rufus_small.jpg]

          .... they have to whistle past that graveyard.
          Report Abuse
        • Author by political_left-religious_right (September 18, 2009 7:02 pm ET)
          2  
          Indeed. If it really makes no difference, then why would so many people on the right continue to lie about it? Not that proud-of-his-ignorance can contemplate that.
          Report Abuse
      • Author by steeve (September 18, 2009 7:08 pm ET)
        2  
        Let me see if I have the timeline figured out.

        A few months ago, conservatism was defeated in a landslide national election. This was because conservatism had failed in such a spectacular and visible way on every issue imaginable.

        After that, the same friggin people who voted for the losers in the election protested.

        Because of that, this shows that conservatism is growing? That victory is coming?
        Report Abuse
    • Author by diamonds (September 18, 2009 6:46 pm ET)
        2
      The only "lie" you could find was the 1.7 million number? And it wasn't even them who made it up, it was the independent media that came up with the 2.1, 1.7 million numbers. Of course people are going to repeat what they have heard that they like, you expect them not to, especially when coming from somewhere like ABC?

      How can you call someone a liar if they repeat what they heard from an otherwise creditable source? It isn't the truth, but it certainly isn't lying.

      Not to mention, no one is using the million numbers anymore (except maybe those who truly have their heads in the sand).

      By the way, go to YouTube, the statements about 9/11 and Katrina were only about a handful of families, the monologue was about how a a few people can spoil it for everyone. You conveniently left out all the charity work he has done for 9/11. But that would undermine the point you are trying to make, I don't blame you.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by steeve (September 18, 2009 7:23 pm ET)
        2  
        I'll leave it to others to point out the actual source of the inflated numbers (hint: not ABC) and go with the more important point.

        "The only 'lie' you could find was the 1.7 million number?"

        That's because it was a puff piece, meaning that it didn't bother with factual assertions, which is the whole problem.

        There are a few thousand negative facts about Beck, and two positive facts (his audience size and his money). It is very strange that a fact-free article still found time to include both of the positive facts.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by diamonds (September 18, 2009 8:16 pm ET)
            2
          I think it is fair to say that solid numbers/factual assertions were not available for a few days. The only numbers at the time were 1.7 million, 2 million, hundreds of thousands, and tens of thousands. There were no factual assertions. Now there are, and the inflated numbers (which common sense, maybe a little research, should have disproved anyways) have disappeared. There were no lies, and the truth won out in the end.

          What more could one want?
          Report Abuse
          • Author by steeve (September 19, 2009 10:02 am ET)
            2  
            I want bad journalism exposed.

            Foser's 30,000 came from a real source. Malkin's 2 million came from a made-up source. But the people who used the made-up source never had to admit it, never had to apologize, never had their readers find out that they're bad journalists who shouldn't be listened to on other matters.
            Report Abuse
      • Author by thenumber17 (September 18, 2009 7:59 pm ET)
           
        I don't watch enough Glenn Beck to speak intelligently about how many lies and how many truths he has spouted (I never watched him regularly, but after seeing the clip of him pretending to pour gasoline on his producer, I decided the guy was a buffoon and not worthy of my time). Regardless, I think you are missing the point, which is that the Time article was a puff piece. Beck may do a lot of charity work for 9/11, and that's great, but an intellectually honest article would also point out what he said about hating 9/11 families. It would do so in the context of your "a few people can spoil it for everyone" if that was the case, but it would still point it out. An intellectually honest article wouldn't make the false equivocation between 70,000 and 2 million. One is the fact, the other is not. Which is not to say I'm ridiculing the fact that only 70,000 people showed up.

        And please don't give me this idea that it's not fair to pick one little thing Beck said and criticize him for it. First, the guy talks for a living. And he purposely tries to be as controversial as possible when he does it. It's how he became a millionaire. So I'd say it's perfectly within reason to criticize him for what he says. I'm not asking that the government shut him up, but I also think he should be called out when he spews nonsense.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by recoveringrepub (September 20, 2009 12:11 pm ET)
        1  
        ABC never reported the 1.7 million number. This has now been repeatedly cited as the source by those who want to believe it.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by justchance (September 19, 2009 8:58 am ET)
         
      I think what we are all forgetting is the ignorance of the majority of the American people. Bill Mahr had some upsetting statistics about the limited knowledge the average person has about such things as the constitution, the bill of rights, Medicare, social security and congress. It should come as no surprise that Americans, many of whom are in a financial hole or know someone close who is, are frightened and want a means of expressing it. It is obviously not enough for daddy to try and fix it. Those of us who have raised children know that when your kid was upset at something, it wasn't enough to go out there and "fix it," for them. You had to find a way for them to vent their upset even as you were fixing it. The need to vent will continue even after the thing is being fixed. In our case it is the economy we were left with. The neocons were quick to trivialize if not exculpate the previous administration. The President fixing it, and it's not a fix that is felt immediately, does not address the upset in the country. The conservative journalists have harnessed that upset to any wagon they feel will cause the administration the most grief. They are diminishing the President and the presidency through outright lies. Campbell Brown came closest to calling them on it. There has to be a much more organized approach on prime time a fact finding documentary. I think it would come best from the mouth of Mr. Clean, Bryan Williams. I think that it should be a program in which all of the lies which are being circulated be be put to the test and shown for what they are. I susspect that Time is pulling a Glenn Beck that is writing something outrageous in hopes of increasing circulation. I wonder if they can stand a similar loss in advertisers that Fox has had?
      Report Abuse
    • Author by nancychatter (September 19, 2009 9:32 am ET)
         
      Great article and so true.
      Everyone who is outraged about the sort of drivel that Glenn Beck spews on a daily basis should be very vocal in their opposition. Write letters to their corporate sponsors and tell them you are not going to use or buy their products if they continue to enable these lies and innuendos to be protrayed as journalism or "real news" for that matter. Glenn Beck and others like him make their own twisted news and don't report "facts", most everything is rumor.
      (A sidenote) I formerly resided in the county near the city(Mt Vernon,Washington) where Glenn Beck was born.(two of my adultchildren still live there) Recently it was brought to my attention that the mayor of Mt,Vernon was to give Glenn Beck the key to the city and proclaimed Sept 26 Glenn Beck day. I was outraged and sent a letter to Bud Norris the mayor and to the local newspaper. Skagit Valley Herald.
      Following is a comment on a Seattle Times article:

      Glenn Beck day? Why not honor the town drunks or meth addicts? And listen to their opinions as well. And put them on a national forum. After... Posted on September 3, 2009 at 1:51 AM by Trumpet.
      My thoughts exactly.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by TheGoat (September 19, 2009 11:57 am ET)
         
      Wait a sec! Isn't Beck responsible for ousting a self-admitted Communist from a top position in Gov't and exposing ACORN for what they are?
      Report Abuse

my.MediaMatters.org

Login  Sign Up

Connect

  • Email

    Receive Jamison's column by email.